Rob
02-21-2007, 06:39 PM
I thought I'd post this e-mail message thread as it may be of help to others.
----- Original Message -----
From: John Saito
Sent: Tue Feb 20 18:34
Subject: Fwd: Re: New Post/Thread Notification: Send A Message To Rob
Rob
Thank you for your reply. This has been a work in progress. I finally nailed this thing down. A lot of it had to do with erroneous wording in the MSI motherboard manual. The short story is that the manual contained a very strong warning (in a grayed out box for emphasis) to NOT initially place mem modules in the 1 and 2 slots (green and purple). The manual implied that the 2 green slots (1 and 3) should be populated BEFORE using a purple slot. That is not correct because my moving the modules to slots 1 and 2 corrected all my issues, and it has been stable for two weeks, even allowing for a little overclocking. I thought I would wait to tell you to ensure that it really WAS the problem.
I tried this on a whim because I frankly could not think of anything else and I also got some indications of memory issues running MemTest 86. I thought the modules were faulty so I started to move them around. When I placed the two 512 MB modules in slots 1 and 2 (which I was not supposed to do according to the manual) everything started working exactly as it should and the memory check on POST showed it as dual channel RAM rather than single channel, which it had shown before. I almost fell off my chair.
Just another note to beware of faulty instructions in manuals. I give credit to the Chinese for mastering English as well as they do, but they SHOULD expend more effort having native English speakers edit their work. I wonder how many others out there have beat their brains out on this. I even called a couple of local computer service people and they were not eager to take this on when I explained the problem. So, I was on my own and unwilling to fork over 200 bucks to the Geek Squad.
Thank you for all the support you give us struggling, fledgling builders.
John
Rob Williams wrote:
Hi, John,
I think your temperatures are fine, so I wouldn't spend any effort trying to get them lower.
It sounds like you're taking the right steps trouble-shooting the problems with the game. The sound card and drivers are a good next suspect. You might also try visiting the message board for the maker of the video game to see if anyone else is having similar problems.
Best Wishes,
Rob
On Fri Feb 2 11:53 , 'My Super PC Forums - Build Your Own Computer - Message Board - Discussion'
Hello,
Here is the message that has just been posted:
***************
Rob
First of all, I would like to thank you for your work on the book and the web site. :) It helped me immeasurably in my most recent build, my second since 1998.
I have gotten my computer up and running, and it does the majority of things I need very well. My configuration is an MSI K8N Neo 4 Series ver 3 mobo (socket 939), AMD 2.2 Gig 3700 San Diego proc with Volcano 12 cooling, BFG 7600 GT OC video card (PCI-E), 1 gig Corsair memory as a paired set of 512 MB, Win XP Professional SP2, and Audigy 2 Value soundcard. I have ensured that the BIOS is the most recent, as are the chipset drivers and drivers for the sound and video cards. I have, to the best of my knowledge, ascertained that the onboard sound is disabled.
The issues I am having are the following:
1. When playing Battlefield Vietnam and Flight Simulator X, I will get some skipping of the sound and then the computer will freeze in a way that can only be remedied with use of the restart button. This is generally not accompanied by any video problems. The freezing will also occur at times when playing Windows Media Player clips. I also notice some sound skipping without freezing in the same games at times, but not so when I only play MP3 songs. I have played Call of Duty 2 without any problems. Since I first suspected a problem with the video card or drivers, I contacted BFG, ran 3D Mark 05, and the program froze early on. BFG concluded that I needed to RMA the card, which I did. After installing the RMA'd card, I ran 3DMark 05 last night without incident and got a score of 6306 and a CPU score of 4460. Looked ok to me. However, the same problems of audio anomalies and freezing occured with the very same games. In the case of BF Vietnam, it occurred at the same points in the game - very early on. I now have problems with FSX when the loading of the game data (real memory intensive) will cause the computer to freeze. I have ensured that the memory was installed as stipulated in the mobo manual.
The work stuff I do at home is handled very well by the computer, but I am anxious to get FSX going. It played decently on my previous computer, a 2500 Sempron, ASUS A7N8X-x mobo, 1 gig memory, and ATI 9600 XT. I know this simulator puts a load on the computer, so I am tweaking settings to find the optimum. Now that I have eliminated the video card and associated drivers (I think) as the problem, I am now looking at the sound card and drivers. I have not yet ruled out the possibility of a conflict between the sound card and video drivers. I noticed that the IRQ of 17 is devoted to the sound card, and it is not sharing that with anything else. The IRQ for the video card is 16, so I have read somewhere that I might consider switching the PCI slot for the sound card. I'll try that first, and do so by uninstalling the present drivers and reinstalling them.
Is there any other thing you can recommend?
2. My CPU cooling solution is working great, but I notice that the GPU is running in the low 40's even when I am doing the non-intensive video stuff. That seems a bit much to me, but you may be able to provide some perspective. BFG's "lifetime" warranty is voided by replacement of their cooling fan, so I do not want to touch that. How well do these little PCI coolers work? I have done all the things with cables and such to ensure adequate case flow, but the location of the PCI-E slot does put the GPU in a place where it may get the best flow.
I realize this is a lengthy email and would appreciate any suggestions you might have.
John Saito
----- Original Message -----
From: John Saito
Sent: Tue Feb 20 18:34
Subject: Fwd: Re: New Post/Thread Notification: Send A Message To Rob
Rob
Thank you for your reply. This has been a work in progress. I finally nailed this thing down. A lot of it had to do with erroneous wording in the MSI motherboard manual. The short story is that the manual contained a very strong warning (in a grayed out box for emphasis) to NOT initially place mem modules in the 1 and 2 slots (green and purple). The manual implied that the 2 green slots (1 and 3) should be populated BEFORE using a purple slot. That is not correct because my moving the modules to slots 1 and 2 corrected all my issues, and it has been stable for two weeks, even allowing for a little overclocking. I thought I would wait to tell you to ensure that it really WAS the problem.
I tried this on a whim because I frankly could not think of anything else and I also got some indications of memory issues running MemTest 86. I thought the modules were faulty so I started to move them around. When I placed the two 512 MB modules in slots 1 and 2 (which I was not supposed to do according to the manual) everything started working exactly as it should and the memory check on POST showed it as dual channel RAM rather than single channel, which it had shown before. I almost fell off my chair.
Just another note to beware of faulty instructions in manuals. I give credit to the Chinese for mastering English as well as they do, but they SHOULD expend more effort having native English speakers edit their work. I wonder how many others out there have beat their brains out on this. I even called a couple of local computer service people and they were not eager to take this on when I explained the problem. So, I was on my own and unwilling to fork over 200 bucks to the Geek Squad.
Thank you for all the support you give us struggling, fledgling builders.
John
Rob Williams wrote:
Hi, John,
I think your temperatures are fine, so I wouldn't spend any effort trying to get them lower.
It sounds like you're taking the right steps trouble-shooting the problems with the game. The sound card and drivers are a good next suspect. You might also try visiting the message board for the maker of the video game to see if anyone else is having similar problems.
Best Wishes,
Rob
On Fri Feb 2 11:53 , 'My Super PC Forums - Build Your Own Computer - Message Board - Discussion'
Hello,
Here is the message that has just been posted:
***************
Rob
First of all, I would like to thank you for your work on the book and the web site. :) It helped me immeasurably in my most recent build, my second since 1998.
I have gotten my computer up and running, and it does the majority of things I need very well. My configuration is an MSI K8N Neo 4 Series ver 3 mobo (socket 939), AMD 2.2 Gig 3700 San Diego proc with Volcano 12 cooling, BFG 7600 GT OC video card (PCI-E), 1 gig Corsair memory as a paired set of 512 MB, Win XP Professional SP2, and Audigy 2 Value soundcard. I have ensured that the BIOS is the most recent, as are the chipset drivers and drivers for the sound and video cards. I have, to the best of my knowledge, ascertained that the onboard sound is disabled.
The issues I am having are the following:
1. When playing Battlefield Vietnam and Flight Simulator X, I will get some skipping of the sound and then the computer will freeze in a way that can only be remedied with use of the restart button. This is generally not accompanied by any video problems. The freezing will also occur at times when playing Windows Media Player clips. I also notice some sound skipping without freezing in the same games at times, but not so when I only play MP3 songs. I have played Call of Duty 2 without any problems. Since I first suspected a problem with the video card or drivers, I contacted BFG, ran 3D Mark 05, and the program froze early on. BFG concluded that I needed to RMA the card, which I did. After installing the RMA'd card, I ran 3DMark 05 last night without incident and got a score of 6306 and a CPU score of 4460. Looked ok to me. However, the same problems of audio anomalies and freezing occured with the very same games. In the case of BF Vietnam, it occurred at the same points in the game - very early on. I now have problems with FSX when the loading of the game data (real memory intensive) will cause the computer to freeze. I have ensured that the memory was installed as stipulated in the mobo manual.
The work stuff I do at home is handled very well by the computer, but I am anxious to get FSX going. It played decently on my previous computer, a 2500 Sempron, ASUS A7N8X-x mobo, 1 gig memory, and ATI 9600 XT. I know this simulator puts a load on the computer, so I am tweaking settings to find the optimum. Now that I have eliminated the video card and associated drivers (I think) as the problem, I am now looking at the sound card and drivers. I have not yet ruled out the possibility of a conflict between the sound card and video drivers. I noticed that the IRQ of 17 is devoted to the sound card, and it is not sharing that with anything else. The IRQ for the video card is 16, so I have read somewhere that I might consider switching the PCI slot for the sound card. I'll try that first, and do so by uninstalling the present drivers and reinstalling them.
Is there any other thing you can recommend?
2. My CPU cooling solution is working great, but I notice that the GPU is running in the low 40's even when I am doing the non-intensive video stuff. That seems a bit much to me, but you may be able to provide some perspective. BFG's "lifetime" warranty is voided by replacement of their cooling fan, so I do not want to touch that. How well do these little PCI coolers work? I have done all the things with cables and such to ensure adequate case flow, but the location of the PCI-E slot does put the GPU in a place where it may get the best flow.
I realize this is a lengthy email and would appreciate any suggestions you might have.
John Saito