First build - please assess

[colin_b88]

Long time lurker, finally got the money saved to take the plunge and put myself to the test. Mainly I'll be doing a lot of downloading, games, movies/music, etc. I don't game too intensely but when I play I don't want any hiccups and want to enjoy the graphics preferably maxed.

I've got a parts list here. Some things I've got a couple options for; let's take a look:

OS: Microsoft Windows 7 Professional 64-bit 1-Pack for System Builders - OEM http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116758

CPU: Intel Core i7-950 Bloomfield 3.06GHz 4 x 256KB L2 Cache 8MB L3 Cache LGA 1366 130W Quad-Core Processor BX80601950 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=19-115-211&SortField=3&SummaryType=0&Pagesize=10&PurchaseMark=&SelectedRating=-1&VideoOnlyMark=False&VendorMark=&IsFeedbackTab=true&Page=2#scrollFullInfo

Case: COOLER MASTER HAF 932 Blue RC-932-KKN3-GP Black Steel ATX Full Tower Computer Case http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=11-119-213&SortField=3&SummaryType=0&Pagesize=10&PurchaseMark=&SelectedRating=-1&VideoOnlyMark=False&VendorMark=&IsFeedbackTab=true&Page=4#scrollFullInfo

Mobo:
Some options here
(leaning toward this one the most) ASUS P6X58D-E LGA 1366 Intel X58 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=13-131-641&SortField=1&SummaryType=0&Pagesize=10&PurchaseMark=&SelectedRating=-1&VideoOnlyMark=False&VendorMark=&IsFeedbackTab=true&Keywords=%28keywords%29&Page=1#scrollFullInfo

(this one looks good but had significantly more negative reviews) GIGABYTE GA-X58A-UD3R LGA 1366 Intel X58 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128423&Tpk=Gigabyte%20GA-X58A-UD3R

RAM:
More options. Is there a real difference between the two Corsairs, seems all same stats but I know Dominator is well reputed but for a bit more money, anyway here we are

CORSAIR DOMINATOR 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Triple Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model TR3X6G1600C8D http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145224

CORSAIR XMS3 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model TR3X6G1600C8 G http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145236

G.SKILL 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Triple Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model F3-12800CL8TU-6GBPI http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=20-231-247&SortField=0&SummaryType=0&Pagesize=10&PurchaseMark=&SelectedRating=-1&VideoOnlyMark=False&VendorMark=&IsFeedbackTab=true&Page=3#scrollFullInfo

GPU:
As I fill this out I am just seeing this has gone out of stock, could it come back relatively soon? There are a few highly similar cards available on newegg but with graphics cards the little differences are a bit over my head. Should I just get the card from tiger/amazon instead or do you recommend a comparable or better card?
ie. difference between this below(the 01G-P3-1373-TR) and say 01G-P3-1373-AR

EVGA 01G-P3-1373-TR GeForce GTX 460 (Fermi) Superclocked EE 1GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video Card http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=14-130-567&SortField=3&SummaryType=0&Pagesize=10&PurchaseMark=&SelectedRating=-1&VideoOnlyMark=False&VendorMark=&IsFeedbackTab=true&Page=2#scrollFullInfo

HDD:
Already have a WD Caviar Black 1TB for storage, this will be for OS and stuff
Western Digital Caviar Black WD6401AALS 640GB 7200 RPM 32MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136319

PSU: Basically is 750w enough for my setup?
CORSAIR HX Series CMPSU-750HX 750W ATX12V 2.3 / EPS12V 2.91 SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS SILVER Certified Modular Active PFC Power Supply http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139010

Monitor:
First is LED, looks great, why the same price as second option..?
ASUS VE247H Black 23.6" 2ms Full HD HDMI LED BackLight LCD Monitor w/Speakers 300 cd/m2 10,000,000:1 (ASCR) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824236112

ASUS VH236HL-P Black 23" 2ms(GTG) HDMI Widescreen Full HD 1080P LCD Monitor w/height & swivel adjustment 300 cd/m2 ASCR 20000 :1 Built in Speakers http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=24-236-065&SortField=3&SummaryType=0&Pagesize=10&PurchaseMark=&SelectedRating=-1&VideoOnlyMark=False&VendorMark=&IsFeedbackTab=true&Keywords=%28keywords%29&Page=2#scrollFullInfo


And as optional wanted to know if based on everything I have here would you recommend a fan/heatsink upgrade from stock or if I should be all set


Truly appreciate the time, I look forward to hear your thoughts!

[RickyTick]

That's really a killer system. You could take any of the options you have it would still be great.

Let me introduce you to this motherboard. It has the same attributes as the two you listed, and is not quite as expensive. The best feature is that it has a 5 yr warranty whereas those other 2 only have a 3 yr warranty. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131665

I don't care for the Corsair XMS series of ram. Maybe it's just me, but I had a bad experience with it in the past, plus they just seem kind of cheap. The Dominators are excellent, same goes for the GSkill.

The GTX460 is hard to beat. I might be tempted to wait a few days just to see what AMD rolls out with the new Cayman series 6xxx card. If nothing else, it may have an effect on the price of the Nvidia cards. The one at Newegg was $180 after rebate. That's the best price I've seen yet. You can buy it directly from EVGA for $190 after MIR and it still has free shipping, but check around with other vendors.
http://www.evga.com/products/moreInfo.asp?pn=01G-P3-1373-AR&family=GeForce%20400%20Series%20Family&sw=

I'm not sure about the monitors. In order for them to be full HD 1080p, you need HDMI, which the x58 motherboard doesn't have.

[RickyTick]

I thought about it a little bit, and I want to clarify my suggestions.
You still have an awesome build there, but if you're not needing to build right away, I would recommend waiting for Sandy Bridge.

[RickyTick]

*Update*
Newegg has the i7-950 on sale for $279.99 if you use Promo Code EMCZNZR48, and it has free shipping.
Also the Corsair Dominator 6gb (3x2gb) of DDR3 1600 is on sale for $110 with Promo code EMCZNZR62, and free shipping.

[colin_b88]

First off i appreciate your response(s).

I think I'm too eager for this build to wait for SB, it seems around its initial release although impressive in itself won't be quite up to what I'm after. Will SB likely phase out LGA 1366 and under within the next year or so, or will we hold our own for at least a couple more?

In regard to your mobo introduction, I've spent quite some time the past 2 days comparing the crap out of the P6X58D-E and Sabertooth, and am still quite torn. I feel like the Sabertooth would be adequate for my needs, but the P6X58D-E seems to have a little extra sparkle and I can't tell if it's worth it. The P6X58D-E is more aesthetically pleasing in the HAF 932 blue but ultimately shouldn't matter.. this part will be tough.

For the monitors, you say x58 can't use HDMI but the GPU has a mini HDMI for the monitor, doesn't that work or does the mobo still hold it back?

Whats the difference in the GTX460 - 01G-P3-1373-AR and 01G-P3-1373-TR? I had the TR in my parts list but the AR has many more reviews and seems more appealing for the same price(after rebate) and I do believe same specs..

The promo codes are great, thank you. I noticed you use the Pi's also, but always hear about Dominator. Do you recommend the Dominators over the G. Skill?

Lastly just to make sure, is the 750w enough for my whole setup?

[RickyTick]

First off i appreciate your response(s).
You're welcome. Glad to offer some help.


I think I'm too eager for this build to wait for SB, it seems around its initial release although impressive in itself won't be quite up to what I'm after. Will SB likely phase out LGA 1366 and under within the next year or so, or will we hold our own for at least a couple more?
I've read that Intel will move 1366 into the workstation market, and away from mainstream. Supposedly Sandy Bridge will become the mainstream chipset.


In regard to your mobo introduction, I've spent quite some time the past 2 days comparing the crap out of the P6X58D-E and Sabertooth, and am still quite torn. I feel like the Sabertooth would be adequate for my needs, but the P6X58D-E seems to have a little extra sparkle and I can't tell if it's worth it. The P6X58D-E is more aesthetically pleasing in the HAF 932 blue but ultimately shouldn't matter.. this part will be tough. Like I said, your choices are excellent. I just wanted to throw something else out there for you to look at.


For the monitors, you say x58 can't use HDMI but the GPU has a mini HDMI for the monitor, doesn't that work or does the mobo still hold it back?
I said that wrong, and I'm not very up to date on the HDMI and 1080p. I thought that in order for you to utilize HDMI, that you motherboard had to support it. I'm not sure that's totally correct. I'll do a little more research.


Whats the difference in the GTX460 - 01G-P3-1373-AR and 01G-P3-1373-TR? I had the TR in my parts list but the AR has many more reviews and seems more appealing for the same price(after rebate) and I do believe same specs..
This will explain the part number differences on the EVGA cards. Basically it's about the warranty.
http://www.evga.com/support/warranty/


The promo codes are great, thank you. I noticed you use the Pi's also, but always hear about Dominator. Do you recommend the Dominators over the G. Skill?
I've been using G.Skill for my builds and have just have confidence in their performance. It's nothing technical or scientific, just my personal preference.


Lastly just to make sure, is the 750w enough for my whole setup?
Yes, it's fine. I'm running a very similar setup with a 620 watt.

[colin_b88]

So what I'm looking at now, the originals stay the same but for the parts I had some options..

Mobo: I decided to take you up on the suggested Sabertooth.

Ram: I was going to get the Dominators because of the promo but unfortunately it'll expire before I place my order, so I'm sure I'll be going with the G. Skill Pi's.

Monitor: I think I'll go with the ASUS VE247H becuase it's LED and for some reason, the same price as the other(which I don't get but whatever). It doesn't have many reviews since it's a fairly new product but I'm hoping I'll be impressed. The only thing that really gets me with ordering it online is the fear of dead pixels, and not being able to return it if it has under the specified amount dead.



Other then that do you think I should get an aftermarket fan/heatsink based on my build?

[RickyTick]

The processor comes with an adequate cooler, but if you want something better, why not.

You just can't beat this for $30.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065

[colin_b88]

I saw a recommendation in another thread and now I'm thinkin about using a SSD for my boot drive instead of the 640GB caviar black.

OCZ Vertex 2 OCZSSD3-2VTX90G 3.5" 90GB SATA II MLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD) (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227601)

Seems impressive, is it really likely boost that much? Price is steep but if it's worth it.. thoughts?

[RickyTick]

Oh they're fast. Really fast. The only problem is dollars per gigabyte. If the price does not deter you, then by all means, go with it.

[colin_b88]

So basically the only reason I haven't ordered yet is I'm waiting for my Amex blue card in the mail, should only be another day or so, although it's the holidays I signed up last Friday.. Anyway it seemed like a little extra security that was worth it.

I'm basically just killing time waiting so in the mean time I've been scrutinizing every aspect of my build, learning everything I can about pretty much all aspects. I feel pretty good about everything I've got now. Unfortunately in waiting all my promos expired but one now, haha.

Based on current promos and combos, just as a little update here's my current complete setup:

Case: COOLER MASTER HAF 932 Blue (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119213)

Mobo: ASUS Sabertooth X58 LGA 1366 Intel X58 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131665)

CPU: Intel Core i7-950 Bloomfield 3.06GHz 4 x 256KB (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115211)

Fan/Heatsink: COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 Plus RR-B10-212P-G1 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103065)

OS: Microsoft Windows 7 Professional 64-bit (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116758)

PSU: CORSAIR HX Series CMPSU-750HX 750W (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139010)

GPU: EVGA 01G-P3-1373-AR GeForce GTX 460 (Fermi) Superclocked EE (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130568)

RAM: G.SKILL PI Series 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231335)

BOOT drive (SSD): OCZ Vertex 2 OCZSSD3-2VTX90G 3.5" 90GB (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227601)

Monitor: ASUS VE247H Black 23.6" 2ms Full HD HDMI LED BackLight LCD (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824236112)

+Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Compound (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835100007)
+BELKIN F8E093 Anti-Static Wrist Strap (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16899888207)

Grand total: $1,643.03 (-$70.00 in rebates)



The only questions I can still think of are

a) I don't know how into SSD's you are and if you think I've found a good one or would recommend on in the same quality range? Price comes second (but is still to be considered). Reviews were hard to find.

b)whether or not the heatsink and RAM will fit together, the heatsink is a fairly good size and the G. Skill has larger then normal spreaders. I can't figure if the heatsink fins will interfere with the DIMM slots, or is it easily done to rotate the heatsink 90 degrees to accommodate? What's the situation with this?

Truly appreciate the input.

[zburns]

Here is a link to a cnet review on your RAM. According to them it has been discontinued. Here's the link: http://reviews.cnet.com/ram-random-access-memory/g-skill-pi-series/1707-3046_7-34070627.html
When I go to the Newegg site, I cannot click on "details" on Newegg to pull up the specs -- weird. When you look, you probably should be looking for a specific model number to separate out discontinued from current.

I would ask other opinions on the cooler. It appears to be on sale for $ 29.99; to me that says they want to get rid of them! It probably works ok from a cooling viewpoint. I would not buy it for the following reasons: It is too big. 6.2 inches tall and weighs one pound & six ounces. When it is installed on your cpu heatsink, the cooler/fan will be cantilevered out 6.2 inches from your mobo and the weight will cause a torque force on the cpu/mobo (the method of mounting tends to compensate for it -- still does not mean it is a good idea). Lots of fins to gather lots of dust -- not a problem with periodic 'blowing out'. To me, it is just too big and too heavy; others might think differently.

Coolers of this size represent the 'end of this type cooler' when coupled with high cpu output of a quad. Liquid cooling makes much more sense, because of smaller size and probably will cool better (lower temps at same conditions). Your investment in cpu, mobo, the OS, SSD, case is all high quality; it just makes more sense to me to couple all those quality components with a decent liquid cooler. The two systems mentioned so far on this forum are CoolIt Systems and CoolerMaster.

I did look at the dimensions of the cooler on the mobo with respect to the RAM slots. Since I cannot identify the RAM specifically to get the dimensions with spreaders (height), I cannot be specific but it appears the fan sits right at 1.5 inches above the mobo. The fan gets close to the RAM slots, probably between 0.75 inches to one inch from the RAM. But the height of the RAM may be higher than 1.5 inches. The fan has to point towards the rear case fan (you cannot rotate the assembly), therefore the long dimension of the fan will parallel the long dimension of the RAM. If there is any negative effect, it would depend on how much higher the RAM is over 1.5 inches. The cpu / cooler fan will be drawing some of its air from the 'heated air' at the top of the RAM -- another reason not to use the Hyper 212 cooler (again my opinion only).

You did not mention a second drive on your parts list; just a boot drive.

[colin_b88]

I already have the storage drive, it's a Western Digital Caviar Black 1TB.

I've read alot of horror stories in reviews for liquid coolers where it leaked and ruined whole systems. Since this is my first build I don't know if I should take that route.

I selected that cooler as per RickyTick's suggestion. If you're really against that particular one is there another you recommend?

And as far as the RAM is concerned what effect does the product being discontinued have? I believe it is still regarded as high quality RAM. What's the difference?

[RickyTick]

The ram you have listed is the PI series from G.Skill. It has a very tall heat spreader and could possible interfere with the cooler. The Hyper 212 has received very high praise in review after review after review. The tall spreaders on the ram is what lead me to go with a self contained liquid cooling system.

[colin_b88]

Precisely why I inquired, the spreaders are indeed tall but I can't find any dimensions listed anywhere, and the cooler is indeed large but I don't know if where the fins actually start if it would be able to clear the RAM.

Because of the lack of available info I looked heavily further into the H50. Although I'm still concerned about a faulty cooler leaking and ruining my everything.. Your personal usage, the large quantity of great reviews, and the convenience in size have steered me toward the self-contained liquid cooler. I have no questions in the effectiveness of either option. It comes down to simply what will work best with all my components. The price is no concern, in fact it just went down and also now has free shipping. Again, my only fear is of a leak and I don't notice immediately resulting in devastation. I do though feel it's worth it to go with the H50.


Also again, why would it matter if that RAM was discontinued?

[RickyTick]

Also again, why would it matter if that RAM was discontinued?

I don't see that it's discontinued. Newegg has it in stock.

[zburns]

Hi Colin, More about the RAM; the CNet article indicated discontinued for this model #, F3-12800CL7T-6GBPI, but it is still listed at Newegg (CAS latency of 7, Timings of 7-8-7-24-2N). The RAM you choose in your first post is Model #, Model F3-12800CL8TU-6GBPI, (CAS latency of 8, timing 8-8-8-21). When I looked at the RAM the first time around, I did not pay attention to the model #s; hence, my confusion, compounded by the CNet notice and the Newegg listing for two very similar products.

Another, bit of confusion about the RAM. The Model F3-12800CL8TU-6GBPI (your listing on the first page), does not appear in the GSkill Website, but the model #, F3-12800CL7T-6GBPI does appear in the GSkill website. Here is the link to the GSkill page: http://www.gskill.com/products.php?page_sel=3&c1=1&c2=3&c3=10

Cooler comment: Guru of 3d does very good reviews. This link on the H-50; you will be most interested in the last page, several paras from the end! Link: http://www.guru3d.com/article/corsair-h50-cpu-cooler-review/1

EDIT just a few minutes after I did the post: I just went back to the GSkill website and entered 'Model F3-12800CL8TU-6GBPI in the search box; this was the result: "Search > Model F3-12800CL8TU-6GBPI, Category: Products News Reseller Distributor, No Result match the Search in this Category, Please try again. " I then entered F3-12800CL7T-6GBPI and it showed up as available. Note: The latencies are different, seem in favor of F3-12800CL7T-6GBPI.

2nd EDIT. Your RAM choice on this page is F3-12800CL7T-6GBPI . On your first post, the RAM by cat# is F3-12800CL8TU-6GBPI (this is the one that does not show up on the GSkill site). Both show up at Newegg. The Latencies look like they are better on F3-12800CL7T-6GBPI .

I was able to estimate the dimensions of the RAM, approx 5-1/4 inches long by 2-3/16" high. (higher than the fan is above the mobo)

[colin_b88]

Cooler info very informative, helped quell some concern in the leakage aspect. Still in the back of my head but all components have risk. I'm getting the H50. My mind is moving on.

Now the RAM, I did initially have the CAS 8 listed, I noticed prices in the Pi's all dropped so for the same previous price of $119.99 on the CAS 8, I switched to the CAS 7. I've been thinking about staying with the CAS 8 since it of course dropped in price also (it's down to $104), I'm on the fence. Would the CAS 7 show worthwhile improvement over the CAS 8 to warrant the 15 bucks? I'm no penny pincher as I'm sure anyone can see from the build, but just curious. Also, they both are still currently in stock on Newegg which leads me to the ongoing wonder:

I'm still confused as to what effect an item being discontinued does. Is it supposed to mean they don't have it available, or they've stopped production, something else? (Based on the link to the cnet review provided by zburns) Why is being discontinued worth taking note of, since BOTH of the options (CAS 7 and CAS 8) are available. What does this mean?

Would the CAS 7 be worth it over the 8?
Why does being discontinued matter?

I noticed the ASUS Sabertooth is not on the Qualified Motherboards List(the Mobo I chose) on the G. SKill site. Will this be a problem?

[zburns]

Manufacturers discontinue a product for various reasons; it is probably best to always stay away from a 'discontinued item' because it is difficult to find out the real reasons why it is discontinued. New improvements, bad performance in the field, forced to keep up with competition, better and cheaper production methods, really all kinds of valid reasons.

I was unable to make Asus Sabertooth X58 show up as a GSkill 'mobo fit' anywhere in the GSkill website, and I tried multiple ways; does not mean it is not there, but I have my doubts. I think your mobo is a recent release (am I wrong or right) late 2010 for the current board?

On the Asus motherboard webpage for socket 1366, there are 17 mobos, 11 of them show up in the GSkill approved lists. All 17 are for X58 chipset which interacts with the memory directly. If you look at the Asus website for a particular mobo, click on 'specifications', look at memory. For your mobo, here is what the memory spec says:

"6 x DIMM, Max. 24 GB, DDR3 1866/1800/1600/1333/1066 Non-ECC,Un-buffered Memory
Triple channel memory architecture
Supports Intel® Extreme Memory Profile (XMP)
*Hyper DIMM support is subject to the physical characteristics of individual CPUs. Some hyper DIMMs only support one DIMM per channel. Refer to Memory QVL (Qualified Vendors Lists) for details".

With regard to the above spec: note the memory speeds; I suggest you google Intel XMP and read it; the last Asus sentence asks purchasers to "refer to QVL --Qualified Vendors Lists. Asus has their list of vendors whose DDR3 memory will work at a particular speed with this mobo -- so you should probably do this.

I also suggest that you email GSkill; get their address from the website. They are in Taiwan (Asus has an office there also, maybe a plant). Just ask them why your Asus mobo is not in their approved list. Also give them the part # of the RAM. They will probably answer back within days I would hope. 11 of the 17 socket 1366 Asus mobos are on the GSkill approved list -- so why not yours.

One last comment. Here is a link to an AmandTech article which is pretty good at explaining a dilemma that Intel has had for some years in how they spec out their "authorized memory speeds". It is a short article, and the last five para's are the important ones.
Here is the link: http://www.anandtech.com/show/2792

My one definite suggestion is to email GSkill and get an 'yay or nay' answer regards the
F3-12800CL7T-6GBPI . If your mobo is a recent release, that may be why it is missing from their list. Also, I would only consider the CAS 7.

Asus goes to the trouble to have a Qualified Vendors List for RAM. Somehow, they (Asus) must require certain tests by a vendor on the RAM, or certain specs so that ASUS knows the specified RAM will work. You have to assume ASUS has good reasons for doing this.

[colin_b88]

Thank you for clearing up what the details of a discontinued item entail.

I checked the site listings for Asus and GSkill also and found similar findings.

The Asus site shows that for the Sabertooth the Gskill CAS 8 and CAS 9 are compatible but does not mention CAS 7. I called Asus and rather rudely they told me they basically don't know anything, just to call Gskill instead.

On the Gskill site I saw the same as you, Sabertooth was simply not listed. I sent them the e-mail as you suggested requesting compatibility between the Sabertooth and CAS 7 and received this:


Dear Customer

The memory you selected should work flawlessly. Just make sure to input memory settings in BIOS such as frequency, timings, and voltage.

Thank you
GSKILL SUPPORT

I also saw in 2 or 3 reviews on newegg for the CAS 7 where other customers had listed the Sabertooth as their current mobo while using that RAM. I do beleive I should be all set. I will just need to learn to input the memory setting in the BIOS. But really I have to learn all the BIOS stuff anyway this is my first build ha.

In last respect the link you provided I actually came across some time ago when first researching the RAM and what might work best for me and along with my components.
Although it's been a little while, I'm thinking you added the article to show the differences in the CAS latency, true? And perhaps hopefully to show I chose a good set with good specs :D?

[zburns]

I am surprised at GSkill's fast reply. Be sure and keep the email, sort of becomes part of your lifetime warranty. Glad you settled on the F3-12800CL7T-6GBPI, and, I assume your email referenced only this one DDR3 memory cat # (meaning GSkill responded only about this one particular cat #). I will give you my reasons on the Anandtech article tomorrow; little complicated to explain right now.

[colin_b88]

I was very impressed with the prompt reply also.

Your assumption is correct. Having seen the CAS 8 (and also CAS 9) in the compatibility list on the Asus Sabertooth page I had only inquired into the CAS 7, as such they only responded on the one model.

I'll check back for the next post. Thank you.

[zburns]

Hi Colin and Happy New Year. This post is about the Anandtech Article I mentioned several posts back. Here is the fourth para from the end:

"Current JDEC specifications list 1.50V as the official voltage specification for DDR3 with a move to 1.35V in the near future and eventually to 1.20V. However, most of the performance oriented DDR3 modules released for the Core 2 platforms generally operated at 1.8V~2.0V in order to hit high speeds with decent latencies." Note the first sentance saying in effect, 1.5 volts max on DDR3 memory. (Because this was a 2009 or 08 article, I did not want to push this 1.5 volt statement too far until I could find some other confirmation that -- my words now -- 1.5 volts max on the memory really mattered. That is why this post is delayed for a matter of days, because I was looking for confirmation)

Here is where I am at with the 1.5 volts max on DDR3. Here is a link from an official Intel Article on Processors with the appropriate dates. Note the latest date is Aug 2010. http://www.intel.com/support/processors/sb/CS-029913.htm

Date Created: 06-Nov-2008
Last Modified: 17-Aug-2010

You can use the link and read the entire article, but their are two paras that I find very 'interesting' (?) (hard to find the right words here!). The paras are short so here they are:

Quote: "What are the Intel® Core™ i7 processor and the Intel® Core™ i5 processor DDR3 memory voltage limitations? (Ans) Intel® recommends using memory that adheres to the Jedec memory specification for DDR3 memory which is 1.5 volts, plus or minus 5%. Anything over this voltage can either damage the processor or significantly reduce the processor life span. "

Quote: "What is the maximum frequency for DDR3 memory when used with Intel® Core™ i7-900 processor series? (Ans) These processors support DDR3 memory with a maximum frequency of 1066 MHz. If faster DDR3 memory is used (such as 1333 MHz or 1600 MHz), it will be down-clocked to operate at 1066 MHz."

I have some brief comments about the voltage: This is Intel saying do not exceed 1.5 volts or you will 'damage or reduce life span of the processor'. There are plenty of other articles on DDR3 and overclocking that advise raising the voltage a little higher than 1.5, say up to 1.65 and some cases even a little more higher than that.

If Intel flat out says 1.5 volts max on DDR3, and others say, "nevermind, just crank it up a little more and do not worry about it" -- I am saying you have to listen to Intel.

So when you assemble your system, I recommend you keep your memory voltage set at 1.5 volts max. Just keep in mind that you will find many articles that say in so many words that it is ok to raise that voltage, but none of those articles authored by Intel.

The other para in the Intel article deals with the 1600 speed being down-clocked to 1066. I am still searching for an adequate explanation that I can make sense from and explain to others.

Here is a link to a brand new review of Corsair DDR3 1600 memory by Guru of 3D, a reviewer I really think does a good job; read the review. He does not mention anything about downclocking. http://www.guru3d.com/article/corsair-vengeance-12gb-ddr3-memory-kit-review/1

The Intel 2008 article was reviewed and ok'ed for publishing in Aug 2010. If Intel was going to back off the voltage statements or the freq down clocking, they would have said so in this article.

[colin_b88]

And a Happy New Year to you, thank you.

I appreciate the warning on the voltage matter. Conveniently the Pi's run at 1.5V, whereas the Corsair Dominators I had as an initial option run at 1.65V. I don't plan to really do any overclocking so this shouldn't be an issue for me, though it was something that if I desired to do so in the future the potential to would've been nice. I think I'll be content with the performance of my PC regardless :)

In respect to The down-clocking I had heard of this previously. I believe it may have been in customer reviews on Newegg. You just go into BIOS and manually set it, correct? This I don't exactly know how to do yet, but I figured it would be covered to some degree in the installation process.

Also I did read the guru3d review, learned some new things about memory in general. Great reference.

Ultimately I think I am ready for this. I finally got my Amex Blue card today. Apparently there were shipping issues so after a phone call they expedited it. Anyways, after all the time waiting for the card my PC has gone up almost $100 from losing out on my promos, combo deals and such. Although it's already been quite the wait and I'm very eager to get this going I'm wondering if it would be worth it to wait a week or two to see if I could save a good bit, but who knows if it might go up more.. Hold off or dive in? Thoughts?


Side note: Although I'm sure you wouldn't tour this forum if you didn't get some degree of enjoyment to begin with, I wanted to express my gratitude for all the time invested in your assistance, as well as RickyTick's. I assure you it does not go unappreciated.

[zburns]

Hi Colin:
In respect to The down-clocking I had heard of this previously. I believe it may have been in customer reviews on Newegg. You just go into BIOS and manually set it, correct? This I don't exactly know how to do yet, but I figured it would be covered to some degree in the installation process.

I think your assumption is correct that you can manually set it. Your Asus manual and Asus Support is an alternative for Asus/Intel information. The Guru 3d review of your mobo (sept 2010 I think), might help. My main suggestion (assuming this is your first build) is to be certain and 'get answers to your questions' at the level that you can understand the answer. Doing the mechanical assembly should be straightforward, but once you 'turn it on', be careful each step from that point onward. Also, I would write down each step you take once you are into the software portion of the build (begins when you turn it on). Knowing exactly what you did helps solve problems later. Obviously, any of us on this forum that can help will do so.

Be sure to use good static control; this cold weather is really bad for static. While Rob's instructions are not specifically for your build, his step by step guidelines are still correct from a "do this first viewpoint". Good luck and let us know how it goes!

Clarification: Because we (non owners of Asus Sabertooth) do not have on line access to an Asus install manual, any detailed questions (about BIOS settings in general, memory speeds specifically) have to go to ASUS directly or to ASUS Support which is a 'forum' but under the Asus name - so I assume Asus directly participates in this forum someway (you can call Asus direct and ask them if they do participate in the forum with their name!!)

[zburns]

Hi Colin: Some clarification below:
The following is the memory spec on the Asus Sabertooth X58 mobo; I took it from the Guru 3D site (same as Newegg):

Memory
Number of Memory Slots 6×240pin
DDR3 1866/1800/1600/1333/1066
Maximum Memory Supported 24GB
Channel Supported Triple Channel

Because the Specification clearly outlines "support" for five speeds from 1066 upwards, logically I would conclude that your Asus Manual (BIOS settings for memory) will instruct you to set the BIOS for the speed value and mfg recommended voltage of the 'memory purchased'; however, voltage value not to exceed 1.5v. [The implication, here, being that 'downclocking to 1066' will be an internal function of the cpu (memory feeds directly into cpu.)]

My reasoning for saying this is that I do not see how a mobo manufacturer can specify support for these frequencies (speeds) knowing full well that the assembler has to 'downclock' the 'supported' frequency (speed) in the BIOS; if this were the case, surely the mobo manufacturer would say so 'up front' in the mobo specs about (the assembler) having to down clock (manually) to 1066.

If your ASUS manual never mentions 'downclocking to 1066 in any context', then obviously if the speed is downclocked (as Intel states), it is done automatically within the cpu. EDIT, one hour later: If downclocking is ignored in the Asus manual, then they are telling you your memory will operate at 1600 speed, if you set it for 1600 (and as previously said, Intel does the downclocking automatically).

(Asus manual is not available as an On Line doc) (This mobo does appear to be constructed with very high grade components - military spec in some cases - and does have innovative heat disipation features to spread heat over a large area of the mobo and not let it concentrate in specific areas like cpu, chipset and memory. While these more costly features do not necessarily sound like major features, they speak loudly for long and reliable component life including memory and cpu..)