First Boot Problem

[condore]

Assembly went fine but on start up there is a problem. It recognizes all the hardware then freezes when it comes to "Verifying DMI pool Data". I also tried restarting and setting the boot menu to the DVD drive with a Windows XP disk in it, it then loads the setup files but when it comes to the point where is says "Starting Windows" I get the blue screen saying Windows stopped to prevent damage to the computer. Has anyone encountered this problem before, could it be a bad MB?

Components are same as Rob's listing except video card is 8800GTS.

[The Wise Monkey]

It definitely sounds like a hardware issue.

Try downloading Memtest and running it to see if there are any problems with your RAM:
http://www.memtest.org/

[condore]

The Antec Sonata has a good power supply but is not sufficient for computers with high end video cards. The supply is 500 watts but is only 22 amps, the 8800GTS video card alone draws 28 amps. I needed to replace the power supply with a 600 watt unit with a higher amperage rating. The new supply cost as much a the Sonata/w power supply, so I would recommend purchasing a case with a better supply to begin with to avoid this problem.

[RickyTick]

The Earthwatts 500 has 2 12v rails for a total of 34a.

Nice review here http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-reviews/2066-antec-earthwatts-500w-power-supply-review.html

Summary of the review

The performance of this power supply is nothing short of stunning for a unit which is included in the price of a case. The Earthwatts 500W bucks the trend of lackluster power supplies which have long been the norm if they are pre-installed into a case. Even alone, this power supply is a force to be reckoned with; its ripple suppression is top-notch, it barely bats an eyelash when faced with a pair of 8800GTS cards and is quite efficient to boot.

If we would be reviewing this power supply as a stand-alone product, it would get heaps of praise. Yet, Antec has included this great little power supply in a budget-oriented case which makes it all the more appealing so in our books, the Earthwatts 500W gets extremely high marks. Antec really deserves a pat on the back for this one."

[condore]

I got the advice about the power supply from a local computer store. They have 3 excellent technicians there and a good reputation. Seeing your comment and the article you referenced left me wondering if they might have been mistaken. So I printed out the article and some specs and went back to see them for their comments. Here is what I was told.

First of all checking with Nvidia on minimum power supply specs for use with the 8800GTS finds that the Antec EA-500 does not meet Nvidia requirements. This particular card draws 28amps on one rail, which is quite a bit for a video card, and the theory of multiplying 17amps per rail times two to get 34amps is not a good way to judge the capacity of the PS to power the video card. The article you referenced even states that “It would be nice to see a bit more power available through the +12V rails”. Not only must you consider the duty cycle of the PS but also power deterioration over time that can amount to a 10% loss per year. The power requirements of a computer should exceed the minimum requirements for each component as stated by the component manufacturer and also the system as a whole with some allowance in case something is added in the future. I was told that the Antec 500 might work but my system was comprised of high-end quality components and did I want to risk damaging them or shortening their life? After a half hour PS discussion I am convinced the move to a larger supply considering my configuration is a wise choice. I am sure that a system with an average video card would be fine with the EA-500. As Rob stated in his comments “The power supply is extremely important. It must be of high quality and it must provide sufficient power”.

To finish, I think Rob has done a fine job with this site and found his suggestions to be very helpful especially with parts suppliers and current prices.

[zburns]

Condore, I would like to help "settle the dust" on this problem you have encountered. If you want to know the "absolute fundemental reason this happened", it is as follows (my opinion): Computer component manufacturers do not provide in a lot of cases, enough information for an interested party to "figure out" all that one has to know in order to understand the basics about the component in question.

I did a post several months ago about exactly the problem you are describing, high end video card current requirements vs PSU requirements but it is buried somewhere in the forums.

Here are two links on this subject, one from Tom's Hardware and one from Wikipedia.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/geforce-radeon-power,2122-6.html
Actual Power Consumption And Current Requirements

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_supply_rail
Power supply rail (definition)

Both links are excellent for the information they convey on the subject matter.

Regards your 8800GTS video card with 28 amps on one rail. The Tom's Hardware article above list all video cards (supposely) at time of writing, and the highest current rating for Invidia 8800 GTS is 14.x amps for one card. My question to you is wherever you got 28 amps, was it for SLI operation of two cards, not one?

Even with just 14.x amps on one card, and the Earthwatts max 17amp output rail, you could still have the problem you describe, ie, not large enought PSU. Other components could be using the same rail and push the total rail requirement beyond 17 amps thus causing your problem.

Regarding Ricky Tick's post in response, that review does state two rails at 17 amp each for a total of 34 amps. It also states two video cards that will run in SLI from the 500 watt supply.

The reviewer made a mistake (my opinion); here is what the reviewer said about the testing of the Earthwatts 500 watt supply and the use of two 8800GTS video cards:

(Quote) "Important note:
Because of processor limitation, 8800GTS cards in SLI are seriously bottlenecked in Company of Heroes. Thus, while they still drew quite a high amount of power, when coupled with a higher end system or playing at higher resolutions they would probably draw much more.

One way or another, I would NOT recommend anything under a good 700W power supply for a pair of 8800GTS cards. These tests are done as benchmarks ONLY." (end Quote)

If you do not see this part of the review or misinterpret it, you may get the opinion that the Earthwatts 500 watt PSU will run two Invidia 8800GTS cards with no prob.. Had the reviewer run the two video cards at max output, the Earthwatts PSU might not have handled it.

Two parts to your problem as you state it. From my research, I can only find 14+ amps for the max output of one 8800 GTS card, therefore, 28+ amps for two cards in SLI.

If you are running one card and were just 2 or 3 amps over the 17 amp max rail output, you could have maybe have had the failure, because other components running alongside the video card would require some amps from that rail.

I do not know for certain one way or the other if it is possible to run the two rails of the Earthwatts PSU in parallel for a total combined amp suppy of 34 amps.

From a PSU design viewpoint, this is easily possible, but would be PSU dependant as to whether it can be done.

Computer power supplies WILL NOT LOSE 10 % of their output on a yearly basis. PSUs designed with components picked for long life and overrated for the application will last for many years. (If a PSU designer is ordered to design the cheapest power supply, he can choose cheap inferior components and pick components very closely rated to actual voltages and current outputs of his new PSU design; the likehood of early failure is possible in this case)

In the case of many years of manufacturing quality PSUs, companies like Antec and others have built a reputation for high quality and long lasting componets. That is why Rob and many others recommend Antec as well as other well known PSU manufacturers.

[condore]

I was shown the 28amp spec in a manual for the Nvidia 8800GTS. The actual card I have is a PNY 8800GTS. I did find specs for it but this differ slightly as follows. Also my system has 2 DW SATA drives one I use for Windows and one for Linux which I didn't mention.

Minimum System Requirements

Intel or AMD compatible motherboard
At least 512MB system RAM
PCI Express or PCI Express 2.0 compliant motherboard with one x16 graphics slot
One 6-pin supplementary power connectors
A minimum 450W or greater system power supply (with 12V current rating of 24A)****
50 MB of available hard drive space
CD-ROM or DVD-ROM drive
Microsoft Windows 2000, XP, or Vista
VGA or DVI-I compatible monitor

**** Minimum system power requirement based on a PC configured with an Intel Core2 Extreme processor QX6700


The problem I first encountered was cured by removing the 8800GTS and inserting a standard graphics card. At first I thought it was the card or other hardware problem which later I discovered it was not. The larger PS cured the problem.

Thanks for the reply, I think these discussions are great and others may find them helpful also.

[zburns]

Another possibility about the way I interpret your info, is that the 28 amps is the PSU minimum for the +12 volt rail; your spec might have provided a recommended PSU wattage of say 400 watts or 500 watts. If the 28 amps meant the above, these are approximate power supply requirements, ie 400 or 500 watts total and minimum 28 amps on 12volt rail. The 28 amps is not the amps your card consumes; I am pretty sure of that.

Like I said in my long post, 28 amps could be the amp requirement for two cards operating in SLI.

In any case, it you run that PSU right at a little over its limit for a continous period of time, there is a point when you are just "slightly over" what your PSU will handle. We have seen such a problem before when the PSU specs looked fine, but increasing the size of the PSU one step up solved the problem.

The recommended PSU wattage values and amp requirements at +12 volt dc from the video card mfgs are not hard and fast values, they are estimates. Again my point is that you can be on the "wrong side of your total estimated" values.

The fact that the reviewer on the Antec PSU ran two 8800GTS cards, but not at full power, sort of says one card should have worked. Again, as you approach the limits of the PSU it does get touchy.

The Toms Hardware Link I provided deals with how to figure all this out.