What I'm looking to have at the end of the day...

[Devil]

Hi,

First, a little about me. I'm in Canada, so I'd like help related to what's available in Canada, etc. My favourite store however is CanadaComputers (http://www.canadacomputers.com), and also Infonec Computers (http://www.infonec.com). They are both based in Canada and they are better in pricing and service than big names like BestBuy (http://www.bestbuy.ca) and Futureshop (http://www.futureshop.ca). I don't know if I can do NewEgg because not sure of their shipping policy to Canada and also the time and also border taxes, etc.

Alright, now.. I have dual monitors. I tend to work from home at times so Microsoft Office opens up a lot, and multi windows. I use an IM aggregator, and Torrent often. I tend to usually have Firefox open with atleast 10-15 tabs open and I hard ever close Firefox.. these tabs stay around till I get a chance to attend to them. Some of these tabs even have Videos in there till I get a chance to see them. Currently I have 18 tabs open, and it's running at 145,528K. With the same amount of tabs being open over the past week, it was running at 544,742K and so I had to restart firefox.

For any other video viewing pleasure, I open Google Chrome, watch and close it. I recently starting using Windows Live Mail desktop and noticed I can't leave it running, or it slowly creeps up on RAM as well. So, I try to keep it shut overnight sometimes.
So, as you can see, browser is huge for me. I listen to music sometimes and I absolutely hate it when the music playback is choppy because I'm "scrolling" over a webpage in Firefox, lol. That would have to go. I don't do any image editing (other than the occasional cropping or red eye removal from pictures in Paint.NET or Picasa respectively). I've never done Video editing although I'm trying to learn (Gonna try using Windows movie maker for my digital camera quick vids).

Store a lotta torrent content. I've even run TVersity (http://www.tversity.com) to stream content like the download torrent stuff to my TV via my XBOX. But I might want to integrate my TV to record some shows for me sometime in the future, so it'd be great to have such an expandable feature.
Noise is a huge issue for me, my CPU is in the living room right next to the window (so when it's sunny, CPU gets hot and fan works harder and gets noisier). It's always noisy, the CPU fan and the PSU fan, I think. So, something that would make this "beast" simmer down and have little to no noise would be great.

If you're still reading, in summary, I want a quiet PC which can be multi-tasking and be fast at the same time so I can throw anything at it and it'll take care of it all without a hitch.

My budget can go up to $1200-$1500.
Any help would be very appreciated!

Thanks in advance. (Fear not, I will thank you at the time of your helpful posting as well)

[RickyTick]

Hi Devil. Welcome to the forums.

I'll just go ahead and list out what I think would be a really great build for your needs. Some of the other guys here may want to offer other suggestions. Newegg is now in Canada also.

Case (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129154) Antec Performance One P180 $155.99 Watch a great video review at 3dgameman (http://www.3dgameman.com/content/view/13507/48/)

PSU (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139006) CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX $109.99

Motherboard (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128358) GIGABYTE GA-EP45-UD3P $168.99

Processor (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115131) Intel Core2 Quad Q9400 2.66GHz $267.99

Ram (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231166) G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 $70.99

GPU (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130468) EVGA 512-P3-1150-TR GeForce GTS 250 $179.99

Hard Drive (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136319) Western Digital Caviar Black WD6401AALS 640GB $99.99

Optical Drive (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827136152CVF) LG Black 22X $30.99

Sound Card (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16829132007) ASUS Xonar D1 $112.99

Operating System (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116488CVF) Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium SP1 64-bit $139.99

That all comes out to $1340 Canadian.

Some may think this is a bit overkill, but it gives you a killer system that is very quiet, and very fast. What do you think?

[Devil]

Hi Devil. Welcome to the forums.

I'll just go ahead and list out what I think would be a really great build for your needs. Some of the other guys here may want to offer other suggestions. Newegg is now in Canada also.

Case (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129154) Antec Performance One P180 $155.99 Watch a great video review at 3dgameman (http://www.3dgameman.com/content/view/13507/48/)

PSU (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139006) CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX $109.99

Motherboard (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128358) GIGABYTE GA-EP45-UD3P $168.99

Processor (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115131) Intel Core2 Quad Q9400 2.66GHz $267.99

Ram (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231166) G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 $70.99

GPU (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130468) EVGA 512-P3-1150-TR GeForce GTS 250 $179.99

Hard Drive (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136319) Western Digital Caviar Black WD6401AALS 640GB $99.99

Optical Drive (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827136152CVF) LG Black 22X $30.99

Sound Card (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16829132007) ASUS Xonar D1 $112.99

Operating System (http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116488CVF) Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium SP1 64-bit $139.99

That all comes out to $1340 Canadian.

Some may think this is a bit overkill, but it gives you a killer system that is very quiet, and very fast. What do you think?

Overkill is better than underkill, IMHO. I love everything that you recommended, except, don't know about the sound card.. because I'm looking to get great 2 speakers that would be simply amazing!

The other thing is the case, I love the specs, but it's a little too tall (big) for my liking. My current case is about 17" tall, and about 8" wide. I think that's big, lol! Is there anything else you can recommend?

I also might not need to get the OS, or the HDD because I currently have a 500GB Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 SATA 3.0Gb/s and I like it. If anything, I'll add on one later. So you think that'd be fine?

Also, would this motherboard support a good TV card that does all the PVR things most of them seem to do these days? (I really want to try running one of those XBMC type HTPCs)

[zburns]

I have been on this forum since sometime in 2007, and, I think you have more apps (data, programs, etc) running at the same time than any "new build", new forum member has ever described.

What CPU do you presently run and how much RAM do you presently have installed? This could be very important. I assume from your discussion that you do have some "slow speed moments" relative to your desire for a "fast" new build.

Given the tremendous amount of data you are trying to "instantaneously process" will require a huge jump from your present rig. The way I interpret your description of the way you operate, I assume you have at least a small dual core and 1 - 2 gig RAM.

I think you need to at least look at more than 4 gig RAM, maybe an i7 processor and 64 bit Vista (to use more than 3.5 gig RAM).

When you say that your music gets choppy when using firefox, that is a sure indication of not enough RAM and/or, not enough parallel processing. I think you have an "exciting situation" to explore. But your present CPU and RAM should be the starting point just to be safe.

Also, whether you use quad or the new i7, you need to know that all the apps you want to run will make decent use (or even just be usable) of the parallel processing capability of the CPU you choose.

[RickyTick]

Hey zburns. Long time, no see.

You make excellent points as always. I just couldn't put together a build using the i7 components within his price range. That's why I chose the Q9400 with 4gb (2x2gb) of ram. Using just 2 sticks of ram leaves the option of easily adding 2 more 2gb sticks later on if needed.

@Devil. You could leave the sound card off and just use the onboard sound.
I went with that particular case because it has the best noise reduction, while still being an excellent cooling case. I'm concerned with you having the pc next to a window. Don't let the sun shine directly on the case. You could take a look at the Antec 300. Its much smaller, and still has plenty of fans to keep it cool.

[zburns]

Hey Ricky. Really been busy for two to three months. Very long days with no time left over. Devils situation really interesting. I understand the price consideration fully, but I cannot get a grasp on what devil's speed / RAM req would be. When he says music "notes" are interrupted while using firefox; when he says video playing on some of 14 or so tabs open all the time. These are serious simultaneous usage requirements which we have not heard about from any other forum member that I remember.

Suppose he had eight tabs open with video running on all; that could be the equivalent of you trying to run two to six video games at the same time. Whatever he presently has is an important reference point for the new build.

[bug]

I would recommend the P182 over the P180 case. There are some internal changes that make routing cables MUCH easier.

You're definitely right about the sound dampening -- it surprised me the first time I booted it! My old computer (Lian Li case) was at least three times as loud... and I had all of the variable fans on high in the P182.

[Devil]

zburns and Ricky, here are the specs from Windows 7 RC's "System" tab

AMD athlon 64 processor 3800+ - 2.41Ghz
2.50GB RAM (2.25GB usable it says)
Creative SB Audigy 2 sound card.

And yes, zburns, I guess my requirements are different. But trust me, due to the new changes in Internet usage this will just be the beginning. I'm guessing my PC is just getting a little old.

I'm also planning to use the new PC (maybe) as a media center that does some PVRing, so let's keep that in mind for expansion. Thanks again guys, and sorry for the delay in my response.

[Devil]

zburns and Ricky, here are the specs from Windows 7 RC's "System" tab

AMD athlon 64 processor 3800+ - 2.41Ghz
2.50GB RAM (2.25GB usable it says)
Creative SB Audigy 2 sound card.

And yes, zburns, I guess my requirements are different. But trust me, due to the new changes in Internet usage this will just be the beginning. I'm guessing my PC is just getting a little old.

I'm also planning to use the new PC (maybe) as a media center that does some PVRing, so let's keep that in mind for expansion. Thanks again guys, and sorry for the delay in my response.


Hi?

[zburns]

Devil! Hi to you also. I apologize for my delay. I thought I would be posting comments several days ago but things just got busier. But I will get some comments up tomorrow. Thanks for your system data; I think that helps.

[zburns]

This will be a short post because I have been called out of town on a business emergency in the last hour, so it will probably be the weekend before I am able to give you my complete comments. But I can say some things quickly that I have been thinking about regards your posts.

First your audio stutter when doing everything else. Your single core processor and RAM, one or the other, is not able to handle the speed and / or time related memory requirements when you have open a lot of "tabs", particularly firefox. New CPU and more memory required to solve the problem.

I use a dual core AMD 5600 and 4 gig memory. Do not run any apps in volumn like you do; however, my rig is very fast for what I do.

I read a bunch of reviews on the i7, several of them I have listed links for. The Intel Core Duo Quads will be built on the Nehalem architecture sometime late 2009, which means current versions of the Core Duo Quads will be very much out paced the new models.

According to one review, Windows 7 and the i7, there is some co-operation between Microsoft and Intel ref Win 7 and the i7 -- makes sense that there would be.

The guru.com review has a statement in it somewhere that games can be played just as fast on a dual core with excellent GPUs (maybe in SLI) as on a i7. Guru also has a separate GPU review on the i7 extreme version which shows a better speed.

What you are presently doing, I think, does reflect a change in the way the Internet is used, and to take "efficient" advantage of the change will require very fast multiple core processing, 64 bit OS, and at least 6 gig of RAM (a guess). Hyperthreading makes the i7 into an 8 core processor, sort of; it does improve speed.

The problem as I see it is a conflict on what to do right now. Intel has a lot of change still occuring. Windows 7 about to come out. What exactly do you take a chance on?? Probably an Intel 920 i7, better a 940 i7, but it is a large outlay either way. What is the chance a later better version shows up in 12 to 18 months?

Two reviews that are helpful follow. The Tom's hardware is the later of the two; the Guru is long and well written and explains things well but written in nov 2008.

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/multi-core-cpu,review-31567.html
http://www.guru3d.com/article/intel-core-i7-920-and-965-review/

I will add to this or edit it this weekend!

[RickyTick]

Sorry dude. Just got home about an hour ago. Been on a 7 day cruise in the Carribean. :D

Now...what was the question again?

[The Wise Monkey]

Ooh, very nice.

I'm not jealous at all... :p

[Devil]

Hi guys,

Apparently the notification emails about replies to this thread are spam and Gmail put them in my spam folder. I usually keep my tabs open to constantly check up on responses, but as you're aware of my RAM problems, I subscribed to the thread and closed the tab. Hence, my delay in responding. Apologies.

Zburns, thank you so very much for the knowledge you've bestowed upon us. The links are very appreciated although I'm not a professional so most of it went right over my head. But one thing I did grasp is that i7 is set to change everything.

12-14 months doesn't make sense to me. I can wait 2-4 months, but that's basically it. I _need_ to have a new one, lol. I'm thinking the i7 will be a good fit. Any other recommendations would be great for me including a GPU. I have the Creative Audigy 2 soundcard and I like it and recently I threw away my 4 year old Altec Lansing 5.1 VS3151 speakers and bought the Logitech Z 2300 which is just awesome! (From the 5 ports in the Creative card, it only plus in ONE cable to the green port, that's it)

I'll wait to hear back from you guys.

[Devil]

Is there any more suggestions from the community?

[RickyTick]

Other than the case, is there anything you don't like about the system I listed out on page one? It's an extremely fast setup, and should handle whatever you throw at it.

I don't really know much about watching TV on the computer. That's what I bought the TV for. :D

[Devil]

Other than the case, is there anything you don't like about the system I listed out on page one? It's an extremely fast setup, and should handle whatever you throw at it.

I don't really know much about watching TV on the computer. That's what I bought the TV for. :D

I like it, I was just looking for more options. :)

[RickyTick]

When you say "more options", do you mean different components than the ones I listed, or do you mean additional components?

[Devil]

When you say "more options", do you mean different components than the ones I listed, or do you mean additional components?

You know how you usually people come out of the woodworks and say "Oh, no.. you should get this" and the other one says "Oh, no you should get THAT!", etc.


Same way.

[The Wise Monkey]

Check out the high end recommended build in my signature for a possible i7 based build.

[Devil]

Check out the high end recommended build in my signature for a possible i7 based build.

Checking it out now..

[Devil]

Checking it out now..

I like it. I even like RickyTick's post on this thread. I'm now thinking it all looks good, but just gotta figure out what PSU and case I should go with. (for the noise problem)

I might even stick with my Creative Audigy 2 card.

[Devil]

Alright, now regarding the case, even those P180, P182 look good. Their dimensions are way too crazy! Makes it look huge!

My current case, which I think is big, is 17" tall, 8" wide, 17" deep. But the Antec P18(0-3) are taller and deeper. Any case that could be my current size?

On another note, this heatsink (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKXz-vm7d6Q&feature=related) is awesome! I wonder if I'd be able to set it up myself.. (this will be my first real build, you know)

[JeffAHayes19]

For all you're looking at doing, considering how much faster and more powerful the Core i7 processors are -- especially considering the relatively meager price difference between the fasted Core 2 quad processors and the Core i7 (particularly meager when weighed against the entire cost of your system build), and the fact that this puts you into an entire new chip architecture which should keep you closer to "state of the art" for a longer period going into the future, I think you'd be well served with the 920 processor.

I think this is especially true considering how much multitasking you like to do on your computer. I'm sort of like that, too. Sometimes I'll have half a dozen programs open at once, and may have MULTIPLE tabs open in one or more programs at once... Ocassionaly, with my current Core 2 duo E 6600 processor, even with 4 GB of PC 6400 RAM and plenty of hard drive space, I get hangs and freezes on occasion -- sometimes even when I DON'T have all those multiple programs or windows open, such as when I'm running Hi-Def video. I'm hoping a much faster processor with an SSD boot drive and high-power video card, this sort of issue will "go away."

Best of luck with your build.
Jeff

[Devil]

For all you're looking at doing, considering how much faster and more powerful the Core i7 processors are -- especially considering the relatively meager price difference between the fasted Core 2 quad processors and the Core i7 (particularly meager when weighed against the entire cost of your system build), and the fact that this puts you into an entire new chip architecture which should keep you closer to "state of the art" for a longer period going into the future, I think you'd be well served with the 920 processor.

I think this is especially true considering how much multitasking you like to do on your computer. I'm sort of like that, too. Sometimes I'll have half a dozen programs open at once, and may have MULTIPLE tabs open in one or more programs at once... Ocassionaly, with my current Core 2 duo E 6600 processor, even with 4 GB of PC 6400 RAM and plenty of hard drive space, I get hangs and freezes on occasion -- sometimes even when I DON'T have all those multiple programs or windows open, such as when I'm running Hi-Def video. I'm hoping a much faster processor with an SSD oot drive and high-power video card, this sort of issue will "go away."

Best of luck with your build.
Jeff

Thank you for the encouragement, Jeff. I have decided too, to use the i7. Especially, like zburns said, because i7 and Windows 7 have done some stuff together. (I'll be getting the Windows 7 Ultimate when it launches)

[zburns]

Hi Devil!! Here are three links on the i5 Lynnfield launch from the Computex tradeshow around the first of this month. There is a strong statement in two of these links that I have also included.

Links as follows:
http://www.overclockersclub.com/news/24920/

http://www.fudzilla.com/content/view/13924/37/

http://techreport.com/discussions.x/17012

Quote from two of the links: "That said, Piednoel told us the new CPU's Turbo Boost feature will also have much greater potency than the Core i7 implementation. That means if the processor's power use stays below a certain threshold, individual cores will be able to clock themselves much higher in order to speed up single-threaded tasks.

Piednoel said we "won't believe" the gains Lynnfield sees from Turbo Boost. He didn't quote any numbers, but a secondary monitor hooked up to the system showed a live 3D bar chart of individual core frequencies. Yellow semi-transparent blocks represented jumps above the default rated clock speed. As you can see, Piednoel probably wasn't kidding: " (end of quote)

I do not know how to evaluate this statement about the Lynnfield relative to the i7. The statement says "astonishing speed on single threaded tasks". When one jumps to say these are virtual eight core processors, ie, when multithreading software is used, I do not have a clue how much faster that makes the system even if you have multi thread software running (how much multi thread software is there really?)

Your original premise was about 15 or so open tabs some with video, etc.. Rhetorical points!! Are all or most of your tabs single threaded? No way to really tell! Etc., etc. My point being is this a significant feature for your specific app.?

Is multi-threading a 2x gain in speed (No it is not) or more like 20 % gain -- anyone really know? How much multi thread software is really out there. I am sure Vista is multi threaded. But what % of your apps are multithread apps?

Bottom line. If I were having to choose between the i7 and Lynnfield right now, I would like to see a benchmark comparison review between the two before buying. That is unless there presently is overwhelming evidence that the i7 is across the board the "outperformer".

One other point, the Lynnfield is an "altered" extension of the i7. Not exactly a new release. Not trying to confuse the issues but this late data may be important to consider.

[Devil]

Hi Devil!! Here are three links on the i5 Lynnfield launch from the Computex tradeshow around the first of this month. There is a strong statement in two of these links that I have also included.

Links as follows:
http://www.overclockersclub.com/news/24920/

http://www.fudzilla.com/content/view/13924/37/

http://techreport.com/discussions.x/17012

Quote from two of the links: "That said, Piednoel told us the new CPU's Turbo Boost feature will also have much greater potency than the Core i7 implementation. That means if the processor's power use stays below a certain threshold, individual cores will be able to clock themselves much higher in order to speed up single-threaded tasks.

Piednoel said we "won't believe" the gains Lynnfield sees from Turbo Boost. He didn't quote any numbers, but a secondary monitor hooked up to the system showed a live 3D bar chart of individual core frequencies. Yellow semi-transparent blocks represented jumps above the default rated clock speed. As you can see, Piednoel probably wasn't kidding: " (end of quote)

I do not know how to evaluate this statement about the Lynnfield relative to the i7. The statement says "astonishing speed on single threaded tasks". When one jumps to say these are virtual eight core processors, ie, when multithreading software is used, I do not have a clue how much faster that makes the system even if you have multi thread software running (how much multi thread software is there really?)

Your original premise was about 15 or so open tabs some with video, etc.. Rhetorical points!! Are all or most of your tabs single threaded? No way to really tell! Etc., etc. My point being is this a significant feature for your specific app.?

Is multi-threading a 2x gain in speed (No it is not) or more like 20 % gain -- anyone really know? How much multi thread software is really out there. I am sure Vista is multi threaded. But what % of your apps are multithread apps?

Bottom line. If I were having to choose between the i7 and Lynnfield right now, I would like to see a benchmark comparison review between the two before buying. That is unless there presently is overwhelming evidence that the i7 is across the board the "outperformer".

One other point, the Lynnfield is an "altered" extension of the i7. Not exactly a new release. Not trying to confuse the issues but this late data may be important to consider.


Hi zburns, that sounds great. However, Firefox 3.5 and Opera 10 (?) and Google Chrome are all multi-threaded. These browsers themselves taking advantage of multi-threaded CPUs says a lot.

Having said that, I don't think apps will immediately start coming on as multi-threaded atleast for another 2-3 years - yet multi-thread CPUs are thriving. Whatever it is, in light of what's the come in the future, I might as well get a CPU that supports it, i.e the i7.

Now, I'm looking to understand the noise constraints re: case, CPU fan, PSU fan, etc.

[zburns]

The OS would be multithreaded. The search engines would be multi threaded but in the end they connect you to your chosen internet address. At that point you may have, or maybe most of the time will have, a single thread software function running -- I am guessing.

In the quote, there is a significant statement: "That said, Piednoel told us the new CPU's Turbo Boost feature will also have much greater potency than the Core i7 implementation. . . . ". This statement clearly implies that the Lynnfield may offer something in the way of "automatic speed increase" that the i7 does not.

Intel is evidently making a big deal out of "improvement to the Turbo Boost feature of the nehalem architecture". They would not make the statement ". . .greater potency than the Core i7 implementation. . . . " unless there is something more positive about that one feature of the Lynnfield as compared to the i7.

Not saying that the i7 is not the best choice, just that the above statement is significant and should be looked at from a comparative viewpoint to the i7. I also wonder why the "astonishing speed increase compared to i7 when single threads are running" appears to be a major feature of the Lynnfield. Why is this their emphasis? To me, it says something about single threads. There are no benchmark comparisons right now but there will be soon, surely.

[Devil]

The OS would be multithreaded. The search engines would be multi threaded but in the end they connect you to your chosen internet address. At that point you may have, or maybe most of the time will have, a single thread software function running -- I am guessing.

In the quote, there is a significant statement: "That said, Piednoel told us the new CPU's Turbo Boost feature will also have much greater potency than the Core i7 implementation. . . . ". This statement clearly implies that the Lynnfield may offer something in the way of "automatic speed increase" that the i7 does not.

Intel is evidently making a big deal out of "improvement to the Turbo Boost feature of the nehalem architecture". They would not make the statement ". . .greater potency than the Core i7 implementation. . . . " unless there is something more positive about that one feature of the Lynnfield as compared to the i7.

Not saying that the i7 is not the best choice, just that the above statement is significant and should be looked at from a comparative viewpoint to the i7. I also wonder why the "astonishing speed increase compared to i7 when single threads are running" appears to be a major feature of the Lynnfield. Why is this their emphasis? To me, it says something about single threads. There are no benchmark comparisons right now but there will be soon, surely.

This also depends on how long the wait would be for this. I'm growing increasing impatient in getting a new rig readied up within a month or 2. So if Lynnfield comes in before then, for a similar price point compared to the i7, then I might grab it up.

Because, when did Intel last disappoint?

[JeffAHayes19]

I, too, briefly considered the Lynnfield processors, but I have the feeling Intel is trying to give them something of a pre-boost to get consumers swayed away from the Core i7 processors and make them more of a professional and "high-end enthusiast" chip. Of course, since there aren't really any Lynnfield processors on the market to compare against yet, who knows?

The fact that Lynnfield doesn't support triple-channel memory access (even though you can still use DDR3 with it -- I don't understand how that works, really) tells me that Intel is taking a BIG STEP BACKWARDS in some respects with this processor. These processors will ALSO start at lower Ghz speeds, with many down around the 2 Ghz point, and intended for NOTEBOOKS. Their high-end processor for desktops will be at 2.66 Ghz, and is REPLACING the Core i7 920, which will not have a replacement in the Core i7 line, with only 950 and 975 processors in the new line (for the time being).

So YES, there may be some single-threaded advantages to Lynnfield that just MIGHT blow some aspects of Core i7 out of the water (but again, we won't know exactly what, and how, for at least a couple of months). But the price for the 2.66 Lynnfield is going to be about the same as the 920, and frankly I just don't see the point... Another thing, the new processors will be 1152? (Not sure that's the EXACT number but it's close to that) pins, vs. 1366 with Core i7. I may be all wet on this, but my thinking is the more pins, the more connections to the motherboard... the more connections to the motherboard, the more STUFF the processor can do.

I might wish I'd waited a few months from now, but then we ALL want a new computer every two or three years, anyway, so... big deal, lol.

Oh, by the way, Devil, you can download the 64-bit version of Windows 7 RC 7100 now and install it as your boot for your system, and it INSTALLS as Windows 7 Ultimate! I had a separate partition on my C: drive that just had files on it. I moved them to an external, reformated it and did that and I now have a dual-boot system. Boots great -- faster than Vista (of course it doesn't have nearly as much software installed, either). Then again, I can't print from it because HP has NO drivers for Windows 7 yet, and not even their Vista 64-bit drivers will work with it, so I'm still spending most of my time on Vista... Internet Explorer (built in) works fine. And I was able to download and run a recent version of AOL. I'm considering just doing RC 7100 until RTM becomes available, although it would be very nice to have a more useable system for the next few months.
Jeff

[Devil]

I, too, briefly considered the Lynnfield processors, but I have the feeling Intel is trying to give them something of a pre-boost to get consumers swayed away from the Core i7 processors and make them more of a professional and "high-end enthusiast" chip. Of course, since there aren't really any Lynnfield processors on the market to compare against yet, who knows?

The fact that Lynnfield doesn't support triple-channel memory access (even though you can still use DDR3 with it -- I don't understand how that works, really) tells me that Intel is taking a BIG STEP BACKWARDS in some respects with this processor. These processors will ALSO start at lower Ghz speeds, with many down around the 2 Ghz point, and intended for NOTEBOOKS. Their high-end processor for desktops will be at 2.66 Ghz, and is REPLACING the Core i7 920, which will not have a replacement in the Core i7 line, with only 950 and 975 processors in the new line (for the time being).

So YES, there may be some single-threaded advantages to Lynnfield that just MIGHT blow some aspects of Core i7 out of the water (but again, we won't know exactly what, and how, for at least a couple of months). But the price for the 2.66 Lynnfield is going to be about the same as the 920, and frankly I just don't see the point... Another thing, the new processors will be 1152? (Not sure that's the EXACT number but it's close to that) pins, vs. 1366 with Core i7. I may be all wet on this, but my thinking is the more pins, the more connections to the motherboard... the more connections to the motherboard, the more STUFF the processor can do.

I might wish I'd waited a few months from now, but then we ALL want a new computer every two or three years, anyway, so... big deal, lol.

Oh, by the way, Devil, you can download the 64-bit version of Windows 7 RC 7100 now and install it as your boot for your system, and it INSTALLS as Windows 7 Ultimate! I had a separate partition on my C: drive that just had files on it. I moved them to an external, reformated it and did that and I now have a dual-boot system. Boots great -- faster than Vista (of course it doesn't have nearly as much software installed, either). Then again, I can't print from it because HP has NO drivers for Windows 7 yet, and not even their Vista 64-bit drivers will work with it, so I'm still spending most of my time on Vista... Internet Explorer (built in) works fine. And I was able to download and run a recent version of AOL. I'm considering just doing RC 7100 until RTM becomes available, although it would be very nice to have a more useable system for the next few months.
Jeff


You're right about the fact that people would want to upgrade. In the next couple years, I'd surely upgrade to a very good PC. Even if my i7 box hasn't been outshined. Simply because I do not want to dust the innards of the i7 box.

I guess I'll be getting the i7 940 as opposed to 920 because I read somewhere that the 940 might live longer because it's better in some aspects compared to the 920.

Regarding the Win 7, I've been dual booting it for a few weeks now. There's even build 7227 of Win 7 out there somewhere if you look hard enough. I'm still on 7100 though. Tried it out to see how Media Center fares. Unfortunately for me, the Media center on Win 7 doesn't recognize my WinTV PVR 150 PCI card.

--

Anyway, coming back to the topic.. I think I'm pretty much sold on CPU, RAM, etc. Now I just need some help on noise cancellation (my older comments), case size, some knowledge on all the watercooling, and that huge heatsink as seen in the video I posted above.

[JeffAHayes19]

If you're planning to step up to the 940, Devil, I'd seriously look into going with its replacement, the 950, instead... Its stock speed is not only 133 Mhz faster (3.066 vs. 2.933 Ghz), but it also has newer architecture including TWO ways to overclock, instead of one -- PLUS, the last time I checked, NewEgg was selling the 950 for $5 less than the 940.

I ALMOST got a 950 instead, and am still wondering if I should have, but I think I'll be happy with what I got.
Jeff

[Devil]

If you're planning to step up to the 940, Devil, I'd seriously look into going with its replacement, the 950, instead... Its stock speed is not only 133 Mhz faster (3.066 vs. 2.933 Ghz), but it also has newer architecture including TWO ways to overclock, instead of one -- PLUS, the last time I checked, NewEgg was selling the 950 for $5 less than the 940.

I ALMOST got a 950 instead, and am still wondering if I should have, but I think I'll be happy with what I got.
Jeff

Holy crap! That's almost $750 with taxes in CAD!

[JeffAHayes19]

Holy crap! That's almost $750 with taxes in CAD!

Well in AMERICAN dollars, it was $5 cheaper than the 940 processor -- at least the last time I looked, earlier in the week. Since I really have no way of looking at things from the Canadian perspective, or knowing how Intel &/or NewEgg prices things in Canada, it's entirely possible the deal isn't as good there.

On the odd chance that my 920 is DOA, I may exchange it for a 950, if NewEgg will let me, since I have the money.
Jeff

[Devil]

Well in AMERICAN dollars, it was $5 cheaper than the 940 processor -- at least the last time I looked, earlier in the week. Since I really have no way of looking at things from the Canadian perspective, or knowing how Intel &/or NewEgg prices things in Canada, it's entirely possible the deal isn't as good there.

On the odd chance that my 920 is DOA, I may exchange it for a 950, if NewEgg will let me, since I have the money.
Jeff

I'll see what I can do. Either way, I'm still looking for closure on the noise department.

[Devil]

Any more input on the noise reduction? Case size?

[The Wise Monkey]

...I've forgotten what the question was... XD

EDIT: Right, re-read most of the thread now, so can offer some better advice (still jealous of Ricky's holiday... :p)

The problem is a simple matter of size. You can't really go for a much smaller case or any high-end graphics card just won't fit - the GTX260-295 are all 10.5" long. Add an 0.5-1" for the PCI-e power connectors, and 5" for the hard drives, and that totals 16" already. OK, you can probably work around this by moving the hard drives around, but other components might get in the way.

This Coolermaster case is smaller than your current one at 15.4" x 7.1" x 16.6", but it requires a miniATX board and it might be a squeeze to fit everything in. Actually, there are no problems with getting a miniATX motherboard as long as you don't need loads of PCI devices or multiple graphics cards. You may also have an issue fitting that Scythe heatsink you mentioned.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119088

[Devil]

Thanks!
Alright, in that case, I think I'm going to go with the next complete configuration I get which employs that heatsink, and fans that don't make noise and a case that's cool and uber silent.

[The Wise Monkey]

The coolest and quietest cases usually have big fans that turn at a slower rpm, thus increasing the size of the case. :)

We can make some recommendations, but it is ultimately up to you - we haven't owned every case ever made. Check through the Newegg reviews, check out the dimensions of cases you like, and come back to us with a few options that we may be able to offer some advice about.

[Devil]

The coolest and quietest cases usually have big fans that turn at a slower rpm, thus increasing the size of the case. :)

We can make some recommendations, but it is ultimately up to you - we haven't owned every case ever made. Check through the Newegg reviews, check out the dimensions of cases you like, and come back to us with a few options that we may be able to offer some advice about.

I see. That's fine. I guess I'm willing to go by the sizes initially mentioned in this thread. Throw me your best configurations, Wise Monkey.

[The Wise Monkey]

We already have! xD

[Devil]

We already have! xD

I know, I know, I mean with more newer suggestions considering my new requests. Please pretty monkey, please?

[The Wise Monkey]

Motherboard - GIGABYTE GA-EX58-UD5 LGA 1366 Intel X58

CPU - Intel Core i7 920 Nehalem 2.66GHz

Power Supply - CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX 750W ATX12V

Ram - G.SKILL 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600

GPU - EVGA 896-P3-1170-AR GeForce GTX 275 896MB

Hard Drive Western Digital Caviar Black WD6401AALS 640GB

D R/W burner with LightScribe

Heatsink - the one you liked :)

Operating System Windows Vista Home Premium 64-bit

Add a case in, and that comes to around $1300.

Are you going to get the 940? I wouldn't recommend it...

[Devil]

Motherboard - GIGABYTE GA-EX58-UD5 LGA 1366 Intel X58

CPU - Intel Core i7 920 Nehalem 2.66GHz

Power Supply - CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX 750W ATX12V

Ram - G.SKILL 6GB (3 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600

GPU - EVGA 896-P3-1170-AR GeForce GTX 275 896MB

Hard Drive Western Digital Caviar Black WD6401AALS 640GB

D R/W burner with LightScribe

Heatsink - the one you liked :)

Operating System Windows Vista Home Premium 64-bit

Add a case in, and that comes to around $1300.

Are you going to get the 940? I wouldn't recommend it...

You wouldn't recommend the 940 over the 920? I wanted to get 940 so my PC last atleast another 3 years before needing an upgrade.

Also, the heatsink, would that lower the CPU fan RPMs because that heatsink keeps the CPU real cool?

[The Wise Monkey]

If you get the 920 and make a small change in the BIOS, you get a 940 for $300 less. There really is no need to get a 940, especially if you are getting a better CPU heatsink as this will allow higher overclocking. You can get the 920 up to 4GHz if you really want, but 3.2GHz is definitely a good point as it doesn't put too much extra stress on the CPU while still offering a great performance boost.

If you wanted the quietest system possible, you could go for a fanless heatsink, but you wouldn't be able to squeeze the same performance out of your CPU - the heatsink you suggested earlier should be very quiet. If not, you can always add a different fan, but Scythe heatsinks have a good reputation for being very quiet.

Believe me, this is a top of the range PC I'm suggesting and shouldn't need to be upgraded at all for a long time. The beauty of the 920 is its overclocking ability, so if you feel you need an extra bit of perfomance in 18 months time, just raise the clock speed to 3.6 and marvel at the difference. :)

[Devil]

If you get the 920 and make a small change in the BIOS, you get a 940 for $300 less. There really is no need to get a 940, especially if you are getting a better CPU heatsink as this will allow higher overclocking. You can get the 920 up to 4GHz if you really want, but 3.2GHz is definitely a good point as it doesn't put too much extra stress on the CPU while still offering a great performance boost.

If you wanted the quietest system possible, you could go for a fanless heatsink, but you wouldn't be able to squeeze the same performance out of your CPU - the heatsink you suggested earlier should be very quiet. If not, you can always add a different fan, but Scythe heatsinks have a good reputation for being very quiet.

Believe me, this is a top of the range PC I'm suggesting and shouldn't need to be upgraded at all for a long time. The beauty of the 920 is its overclocking ability, so if you feel you need an extra bit of perfomance in 18 months time, just raise the clock speed to 3.6 and marvel at the difference. :)

Alright, we shall talk about the overclocking process as that's one thing that scares the crappola outta me. I think in a day or so, I'm going to make a move on making purchases. If anyone else wants to chime in, please feel free to just do it!

[Devil]

Also this scythe heatsink doesn't seem to be available on NewEgg.ca. So before I start looking for it elsewhere, would this fit well on the gigabyte mobo you guys suggested I get?

[Devil]

And finally, here is my shopping cart (http://drop.io/ivoh179/asset/order-pdf) on NewEgg. Still don't know which case to go with P182 or P183 Antec. Would love some final help about it.. and some one pointing out the heatsink purchase spot in Canada as well..

Scythe (http://www.silentpcreview.com/article251-page1.html) Ninja (http://www.scythe-usa.com/product/cpu/038/scnj2000_detail.html)
Notua NH-U12P (http://www.hitechlegion.com/reviews/cooling/heatsinksfans/674-noctua-nh-u12p-special-edition-se1366-heatsink)
(These both look the same?)

[Thas]

Going to jump in with some personal, real-world experience.
I currently have 105 tabs open in firefox. (Yes, 105.). I just tested running 6 HD youtube vids (HD movie trailers, fullscreen) at the same time, with music playing in the background, using winamp. The music from winamp was perfect, sound from vids was perfect, and the framerate of the vids was also perfect.

My specs:
Intel C2D E8400 (stock, 3 ghz)
4gig DDR2 Ram
Nvidia 8800gt


In other words, you will be easily able to watch 15 movies at a time, while running 200 tabs, with other programs being used, with your current setup. You will probably be able to save 200 dollars, and still be able to do everything you want to use your machine for.

Good luck with your build :) (Also, forgive me for I only read the first 2 pages of the thread)

[Devil]

Going to jump in with some personal, real-world experience.
I currently have 105 tabs open in firefox. (Yes, 105.). I just tested running 6 HD youtube vids (HD movie trailers, fullscreen) at the same time, with music playing in the background, using winamp. The music from winamp was perfect, sound from vids was perfect, and the framerate of the vids was also perfect.

My specs:
Intel C2D E8400 (stock, 3 ghz)
4gig DDR2 Ram
Nvidia 8800gt


In other words, you will be easily able to watch 15 movies at a time, while running 200 tabs, with other programs being used, with your current setup. You will probably be able to save 200 dollars, and still be able to do everything you want to use your machine for.

Good luck with your build :) (Also, forgive me for I only read the first 2 pages of the thread)

Thank you for your comments!
I'm looking to have an awesome build that will stay with me (and any thing I throw at it like new softwares) for the next 2-3 years. I was told earlier that the build is going to cost me around $1300, and I'm already at $1460 without the case, heatsink and HDD(s), but I'm still fine with it because I want to make sure to do it right so I don't have to look at it again, lol


PS: Still waiting on help for the case and heatsink so I can click the order button :)

[Devil]

I think I'm just gonna go with the P183.. but still lookin for help on the heatsink!

[The Wise Monkey]

Well, the Scythe Mugen-2 is good:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185093

Or the Noctua UH-12P:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835608007

[Devil]

Well, the Scythe Mugen-2 is good:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835185093

Or the Noctua UH-12P:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835608007

Getting the Noctua!
Thanks a ton with all the help TWM!

My final question, would the PSU be fine for everything like the GPU, etc? Would the size of the EVGA vid card be too big? Would I be able to fit both the fans on the Noctua without problems?

[The Wise Monkey]

In order: yes, no, maybe. :D

Even if you can't fit both fans on the Noctua, it will still work very well with just the one. You may find that it interferes with the RAM with both fans attached.

You can always move your hard drive around to leave enough room for the graphics card.

[Devil]

In order: yes, no, maybe. :D

Even if you can't fit both fans on the Noctua, it will still work very well with just the one. You may find that it interferes with the RAM with both fans attached.

You can always move your hard drive around to leave enough room for the graphics card.

But the HDDs are going to be in their own section away from the mobo in the P183, right?

[The Wise Monkey]

Yes, but the graphics card is very long and requires two power connectors, so it might interfere with them. You can just move the hard drives up or down (there should be several slots) so that the card fits inbetween them or to either side.

[Devil]

Yes, but the graphics card is very long and requires two power connectors, so it might interfere with them. You can just move the hard drives up or down (there should be several slots) so that the card fits inbetween them or to either side.

Oh man, I hope it all works out for me somehow and I can do this properly without breaking things... or I'll cry. :(

[The Wise Monkey]

Nah, you'll be fine.

Just be careful, take your time, and keep yourself grounded (literally and metaphorically). :)

[Devil]

Thanks.
I was just looking at the PSU I'm gonna get with the P-183, which is the Antec CP-850 (100 watt more than the Corsair that was recommended), and it looks like it's got a lotta oomph compared to the Corsair. Do you agree?

[RickyTick]

That CP850 is an excellent psu, but it only fits Antec P183, P192, and 1200 cases, and nothing else. You won't be able to transfer it to any other case later on if you need to.

[Devil]

That CP850 is an excellent psu, but it only fits Antec P183, P192, and 1200 cases, and nothing else. You won't be able to transfer it to any other case later on if you need to.

You think it's better than the Corsair that I'm about to buy? (And yes, wouldn't move to another case)