Introduction and seeking advice.

[Perhaps]

Hello everbody.
Great site, thank you for the wonderful resource.

I'm currently very interested in building a PC for myself. My current PC is almost 10 yrs old - enough said.
For the past couple months I've been reading, learning and researching. My goal was to complete my build
before Christmas. However, I see that the new i7 cores have hit the mass-build retailers recently. So maybe
I should alter the time table for my build.

My question is
"How long will it take for the old technology to depreciate?"
These new cores have a new socket size so the motherboards with the other sizes along with the duo and quad core
CPUs should should go down in price, right? Then again I just might go with the new.

Any thoughts on projected changes in the market.

By the way, my build will be for top-tier gaming with a budget under $2,000.
Monitor to be included in the budget. I've held off compiling a build list for now. I'd like to see what advice
would be offered here.

[The Wise Monkey]

Welcome. :)

The problem with using bleeding-edge technology is that there are always going to be a few problems at the start. That said, you will be more future-proofed than if you used an older socket/CPU combination.

The standard i7 920 is about $300, but you will need an X58 motherboard to go with that, which is another $250 at least. For that $550, you could get a Q9550, which has a higher clock speed than the 920 and performs consistently better, and a very decent motherboard, plus at least 4GB of dual/triple-channel RAM, which would set you back another $200, thus making $750 for just the CPU, mobo and RAM.

I think that it is still too early to go for the i7. You are better off waiting for a few weeks for manufacturers to get enough stock in so that they can justify reducing the prices, but I don't think that Intel have any plans for sweeping price cuts in the near future.

My advice would be to get a Q9550 and spend the extra on a 4870X2. :D

[Rob]

Wise Monkey nailed it.

[Perhaps]

Indeed.


Although it's the nature of the beast, I guess I'm just trying to avoid spending money on something
that will soon be obsolete.

The 4870x2 has definately caught my eye. I think after I'm done spending money on Christmas gifts for
others, I'll spend the extra I have put in a secret place. :D

Hope everyone has a good holiday. I'll be around here from time to time.

[RickyTick]

Rob and Wise Monkey are right, as usual. But just for fun, I gave it a go.

Intel Core i7-920 $300
Gigabyte GA-EX58-UD5 $300
6gb (3x2gb) DDR3 1066 $200
Geforce GTX260 216 $280
WD Caviar Se16 640GB $85
Optical Drive $30
PSU $130
Case $100

Total $1425

Leaves $575 for monitor, mouse, keyboard, OS, and maybe even a sound card, or an extra hard drive.
This thing would rock! :D

Oh, and I almost forgot to mention. The Antec 900 case is on sale at Newegg for $60 with free shipping.

[The Wise Monkey]

That is an excellent PC Ricky - all prices from newegg? I forgot that Perhaps's budget was for around $2000... XD

You can get the Samsung 2253BW for $230 (excellent monitor): http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824001268

Vista 64 for $100:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116488

This still leaves $245 for keyboard and mouse, which is more than enough. You don't really need a separate sound card any more as the quality of built-in audio processing is very high, but you could pick up a Creative X-Fi for about $50.

An alternative would be to get the i7 940, which is $580, but I think that this is just too expensive at the moment.

If you can get the links, can you add that to the recommended builds sticky please, Ricky?

[RickyTick]

It was all Newegg, and sure I'll put together the links. Stay tuned...:)

[RickyTick]

Processor - Intel i7-920 $299.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115202

Motherboard - Gigabyte GA-EX58-UD $298.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128362

Ram - Crucial 6gb (3x2gb) DDR3 1066 $179.00
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148246

Video Card - EVGA GTX260 core 216 Superclocked $259.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130400

Hard Drive - Western Digital Caviar SE16 640gb $69.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136218

Power Supply - PC Power & Cooling Silencer 750 $129.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817341011

Arbitrary Case $100
Optical Drive $30
Vista 64 bit $100
Keyboard and Mouse $80

Totals $1548

[Perhaps]

I really appreciate the advice and suggestions.

A little background is in order I guess. I'm what you'd probably call a newbie. I've done basics like minor bios
tweaking / updating. Overdrive proccessors, ram, etherenet, video and sound card upgrades. This will be my first
build from scratch though.

I'm still learning terminologies and the new technologies that have come out since I've last touched my PC.
(approx. 8 years ago)

I've had some free time and started a list. I ran into a few questions though. First the list (feel free to hack
it apart) then the questions.

List

Case:

Antec Nine Hundred $109.99 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129021&Tpk=Antec%20Nine%20Hundred%20Black)

PSU: UNDECIDED see below

Motherboard:
ASUS P5Q3 $149.99 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131344)

CPU:
Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 $319.99 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115041)

CPU Cooler:
ZALMAN 9500A $45.99 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835118223&Tpk=ZALMAN%209500A)

RAM:
(2) Crucial 2GB, 240-pin DIMM, DDR3 PC3-10600 $139.98 (http://www.crucial.com/store/mpartspecs.aspx?mtbpoid=1D63F3A7A5CA7304)

GPU:
GIGABYTE GV-R487X2-2GH-B Radeon HD 4870 X2 $529.99 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125233&Tpk=GIGABYTE%20GV-R487X2-2GH-B)

Sound card:
UNDECIDED see below

Hard Drive(s):
UNDECIDED see below

Optical Drive(s):
UNDECIDED see below

OS:
windows vista home premium 64 bit
Thank you for the above link. :)


$1,295.93 so far not including shipping.

Change of plans. Monitor already bought and out of the budget - (Dell 2408WFP Ultrasharp 24
Inch Widescreen Flat Panel LCD Monitor). (http://www.dell.com/content/products/productdetails.aspx/monitor_2408wfp?c=us&l=en&s=dfo)

Reusing speakers: (Altec Lansing ADA 995 ) (http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/acc/ada995/specs.htm)




Questions:
The outer dimension of the case are close to what I need. Very good cooling as well. I read about people
having fitment issues with the bigger video cards and non-OEM coolers.

How can I be sure the other components will fit?

I'm looking to add an identical video card a year or two down the road (crossfirex).
How can I figure out an adequate power supply? Fitment for both?

In regards to the MoBo-
What is the difference between 8 phase/ 16 phase power?

In regards to the GPU-
What is the difference between all the cards out there?
They all look the same to me.
ie Gigabyte, Sapphire, Diamond, Patel etc.

Also the August release date for these doesn't exactly fall into the 6 month rule. The way these outperform current cards, is
there any reason these wouldn't be a good buy?

Are sound card inputs universal enough to accomodate my 5.1 system?

Are 3.5 floppy drives extinct? Now-a-days you just burn all drivers to a cd and have the cd drive the primary boot device?

I figured you guys could point me to decent HDD, DVD R/W and CD R/W deals. Being out of the loop is such a helpless feeling. :)

Wow, that was longer then I expected. Like I said, I'm still learning here.
With the monitor out of the budget now, I was exploring the higher-end possibilities. Needless spending?
Again, all the help is greatly appreciated.
Thank you for the patience.

Now I need to take some time and go over the reccomendations in the last couple posts. :cool:

[chunkylover53]

Yikes... a $530 GPU? :eek: I'm not going to come out and call it needless spending, but that seems a bit meaty for someone that's been using a 10yr old rig. I get it, you want to splurge and "future proof" :rolleyes: a little, but once you build your first rig there is no way you'll be able to wait 10yrs again. Plus, I'm not sure it's really worth it for the extra oomph you'll get out of it vs. the GTX260 Ricky reco'd.

My POV (as the penny pincher of the group), is that if your going to spend the money, why not buy the $260 card and spend the savings to upgrade to a Blu-Ray burner? That's something that you can really get incremental enjoyment out of vs. the next step up video card. Cue the cries of "HERESY"!

As far as some other thoughts...
1) I have your monitor, and you were right to invest a chunk of money there. As far as "enjoyment factor", that will deliver big-time.
2) The PSU reco from Ricky should be more than enough, even if you buy that beast GPU
3) Ditto the HDD he reco'd
4) I'd say that a floppy is extinct, becasue most newer boards should be able to boot from a USB stick, but I'd like to hear other feedback on that. I personally bought a floppy that is also a 20 in 1 card reader, and that is always useful, but it's sort of redundant because that monitor has a built in card reader.
5) The sound inputs on that motherboard will accomodate the speakers you have. I think the only difference will be you will plug the yellow speaker connector to the orange input on the mobo. The rest of the colors should be the same (green to green, black to black, blue to blue).

[RickyTick]

Yikes... a $530 GPU? :eek:

I had the same reaction Chunky. :eek:

Perhaps,
The 900 case is fabulous. Its very roomy, and has a reputation of being great at cooling. I have one with all the fans turned to medium and the sound is very tolerable. In reviews, the only criticism has been that the motherboard tray is not removable, but since it has so much room, the reviewers let it slide. I just got an email from Newegg advertising it at $60 with free shipping. I'll check to see if you need a coupon code and get back to you. (I'm at work now) Here's a video review by Rodney Reynolds.
http://www.3dgameman.com/content/view/6347/48/

You don't necessarily need that cpu cooler, and with the savings on the video card, you could give serious consideration to the Intel i7 Build I listed out.

[Perhaps]

I'm totally open to the reccommendations here.
I might have answered my own question regarding the GPU.

Upon further researching, it isn't as simple as running two of those in crossefireX mode
for more graphical power. You'll ultimately be limited by the chipset and CPU. Going by the parts
I listed, the gain of a second card would be very limited. There's a lot to learn and I'll slowly get there.
I'm getting more excited about this build every day.

Thanks for looking into that RickyTick.

[RickyTick]

The gain from going from one video card, to SLI or Crossfire is not geat considering the increase in costs. Sticking with the single GTX260 core216 card will play any game you have at its highest settings on that 24" monitor.

The problem with the i7 build is that it also increases the accompanying components.

You can certainly go with a P45 based system that will be blistering fast, reliable, and stable, while also providing longevity in use. Here's what I would recommend within you budget.

Motherboard - Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3P $117 after rebate
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128358

Processor - Intel Core2Quad Q9550 $320 comes with Far Cry 2 for free
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115041

CPU Cooler - OCZ Vendetta II $40 after rebate
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835202007

Ram - 4gb (2x2gb) DDR2 1066 $60
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231166

GPU - EVGA GTX260 core 216 Superclocked $260
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130400

Hard Drive - WD Caviar SE16 640GB $70
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136218

Optical Drive - Samsung SH-S223Q $28
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827151173

Blu-ray combo drive - LG GGC-H20L Blu-ray combo drive $150
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827136133

PSU - Corsair 750TX $100 after rebate
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139006

Antec 900 for $60 with free shipping.

Total $1205

Add a nice keyboard and mouse and you're at about $1300.
That's also a killer system. You could do without the blu-ray and save $150.

What do you think of that?

[The Wise Monkey]

HERESY!

Ahem, sorry, got carried away there. :D

Looking good - you have all listed very good potential systems here. I think that Ricky's latest recommendations offer more future compatibility options, and is probably a better bet if this is your first PC built from scratch. The Blu-Ray-RW is a nice touch. :)

If you prefer ATI, you could go with a 4870, then add another later on for CrossFire if you want. The 4870 is marginally better than the GTX260 in performance terms and is about the same price:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814129113

[RickyTick]

If you prefer ATI, you could go with a 4870, then add another later on for CrossFire if you want. The 4870 is marginally better than the GTX260 in performance terms and is about the same price:


I think due to the latest Nvidia (Big Bang) drivers, the GTX260 is performing slightly better than the 4870, and the with the latest round of price reductions by Nvidia, it now seems to be a better choice.

http://www.guru3d.com/article/top-10-games-with-radeon-4870-1-gb--geforce-gtx-260-core-216-test/

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/video/display/radeon-hd4870-1024.html

http://www.driverheaven.net/reviews.php?reviewid=668

[blazer]

any more info on the antec 900 for $60.
i can't find anything on it on newegg

[RickyTick]

Here's a shot of the email I received from Newegg. This price is only good for Black Friday 11/26/08. You probably should log in early in the morning.

http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk156/Mike-Echo/INDEX_3a.gif

[blazer]

here in the usa, black friday is 11/28

[RickyTick]

Sorry, you couldn't see the entire ad. It says that Black Friday is coming early this year and starts on 11/26. Hey wait, thats today!!

If anyone is interest in seeing the entire ad, I'd be happy to forward the email to you.

[blazer]

please do

[RickyTick]

Done:)

[Perhaps]

Is that special for today only? I just got in from work and I want to read through some of the links
you guys have posted. I don't like to rush purchases. Well, the monitor was an exception. :) Couldn't go
wrong for $547. I looked last night and they are selling them for $689. Checking it out now, they are selling them for $517.
Can't win them all I guess.

Thanks for all the input, I could use the guidance.
I'll post later once I've had a chance to settle in and go through some of that stuff.

[RickyTick]

The sale started today, but will probably continue while supplies last. The 900 has been on sale before at that price and didn't last long. If this is the case you want, I would suggest jumping on it now.

btw, I have this case and love it.

[The Wise Monkey]

I think due to the latest Nvidia (Big Bang) drivers, the GTX260 is performing slightly better than the 4870, and the with the latest round of price reductions by Nvidia, it now seems to be a better choice.


Nice articles - I hadn't seen anything that up to date. :D

Seems like nVidia have done a good job with their new drivers. Hope ATI will respond now.

[Perhaps]

What do you think of that?

I like it a lot.
After adding keyboard, mouse, OS and soundcard I'm right around $1400.

I pulled the trigger on the case yesterday. I'm going to probably wait
til after the holiday to get the rest.


Case: Antec Nine Hundred $60 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129021)

PSU: CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX $70 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139006)

MoBo: GIGABYTE GA-EP45-UD3P $100 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128358)

CPU: Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 Yorkfield 2.83GHz $320 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115041)

CPU Cooler: OCZ OCZTVEND2 120mm Rifle CPU Cooler $40 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835202007)

Thermal Paste: Arctic Silver 5 $6 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835100007)

GPU: EVGA 896-P3-1267-AR GeForce GTX 260 Core 216 Superclocked $260 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130400)

HDD: Western Digital Caviar SE16 WD6400AAKS 640GB $70 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136218)

RAM: G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) $60 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231166)

Optical #1 : LG GGC-H20L 16X Blu-ray/HD DVD $150 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827136133)

Optical #2: SAMSUNG CD / DVD Burner $28 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827151173)

OS: Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium SP1 64-bit $80 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116488)

Soundcard: Creative Sound Blaster X-Fi XtremeGamer 7.1 $91 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16829102006)

Keyboard: ABS M1 $70 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16823224001)

Mouse: Microsoft Intellimouse Opt 1.1 D58-00028S $22 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826105100)

Total: $1427

Minus the Blu-ray and soundcard: $1186

If you pick lower priced keyboard/mouse along with no OS (if previously bought) you have a heck of a deal.
A little over $1000.

Any other suggestions before I take the leap? Cables, adapters or something I'm forgetting?
Would it be worth cross-shopping vendors? (newegg, tiger, zipzoom)
Thanks again everyone.
Have a Happy Thanksgiving.

[The Wise Monkey]

You are better off getting everything from the same vendor at the same time to save on shipping costs.

Looks a great build. :)

[RickyTick]

Would it be worth cross-shopping vendors? (newegg, tiger, zipzoom)
Thanks again everyone.
Have a Happy Thanksgiving.

It wouldn't hurt to at least look around and see what other vendors have. I really like zipzoomfly.

Sometimes shipping costs can be a lot, so if you can get it all at one place and save, then yeah.

[Perhaps]

small update:

I selected 3-day shipping for the order. Everything made it on time except for the Motherboard and CPU Cooler.
I have everything prepped, latest drivers ready to go, tools ready and everything arrived intact.

Once I get the last two items in, I'll see what I can get done in my spare time. Can't wait to get started.

[The Wise Monkey]

Good luck!

Let us know how you get on. :D

[Perhaps]

A few question before first boot.

PSU exhaust fan - no connection to MoBo?

Case fans - 12v 4pin connectors to PSU only?

Only fan header used from MoBo is the CPU fan header?

Nothing is hooked up to the PWR_on fan header on MoBo. Does that matter?

No internal speaker connection?

Is it required to connect USB cable to monitor at this time?

I only had 8 MoBo screws vs 9 brass stand offs. I now notice I have 8 paper washers.
Where do those go?



So far.
PSU in.
CPU in.
CPU cooler/paste in. (cpu fan to Mobo in)
Ram in.
I/O shield and Motherboard in.
Vid card in.
Power to vid card (PCIe x2) in.
Power 24 pin and 8 pin to Motherboard in.
Front panel to MoBo reset, power and HDD activity in.
Front panel USB and Firewire in.
Monitor DVI and Power in.

[Perhaps]

This should be my last post in this thread.
Thank you all for the advice and suggestions.

If anyone out there now is thinking about doing this. Go for it. I priced similar
builds by using customizers at the online retailers. Big, BIG savings by doing it yourself.
If you're taking the plunge, check out what I had to say HERE (http://forums.mysuperpc.com/showthread.php?t=2186).